How does the alltrac hold up to modern times?

How does the alltrac hold up to modern times?

Long story short is I used to own a 1990 celica st as my first car then moved on to drive a 1997 acura RL. I always wanted an alltrac version of it. Recently I am looking at cars and found 2 of the cars I liked at a reasonable price.

1. It's either a 1990 or a 1991 all-trac celica owner has posted it several times on craiglist and over time has come down in price. Originally it had a rebuild jdm engine, then I guess had a leaking problem in Neutral gear and he decided try to sell it. Didn't sell, went off the market for a while, then he reposted it with a transmission swap, was priced a bit higher than usual and it didn't generate interest. He put it up recently at a more reasonable price stating that it has to go and that it has a knock at the top end and that he thinks it's the timing is off. Car has had some issues over the years and I am a bit concerned about the quality of life the car has had and I think there's a small chance it could be a money sink if he hasn't disclosed any other problems or that if there's any other problem.

2. Other vehicle is a bit high mileage 2005 Subaru Forester XT turbo manual, I heard those things are sleepers and haul ass. History I know so far is car was traded in, mileage was a bit high dealer would like to offer it cheaper before it's sent off to the auction, dealers rather sell fast higher mileage vehicles to make space for more desirable low mileage vehicles.

Reason I find the forester appealing it's fast, could add the turbo and intercooler from the sti, would probably not be that bad to insure since it's a considered a wagon instead of a suv or a van. Parts would probably be more readily avaliable, no rust.
Dislikes would probably be wish it was a bit larger and longer for my height.

Reason I like the all-trac, always wanted one it's comfortable since I am 6'2, retro cool looks.
dislikes would probably be finding parts, reliability and cost to maintain an old vehicle, finding one in the correct condition that has not been modded un-tasteful with cheesy wheels and unnecessary bling.

Questions are how bad is it to insure an alltrac?
Is the all-trac a vehicle that is high on maintenance to keep running or unreliable?
How does the awd on the all-trac compare to more modern awd such as the one on the forester?
If I am accessing things correctly would it cost a ton more to get more performance out of the all-trac? (I think I would be happy with 300HP-350)
Is it even a good idea to toy with the idea of a manual car because I can find cars I can afford that are manual? (ain't got the kind of money for the new performance cars with auto and awd).

Sorry for all the questions, would prefer to get input from people that have owned the all-trac, I haven't owned a celica since my st about 8yrs ago.

Things to know about me.
I don't know how to drive a manual yet.
If I go with the celica If I can insure it cheap enough it would compliment my acura rl.
If I go with the forester xt I would probably fit the bill completely and I wouldn't need my old car.
It snows where I live part of the year.
I live in an apartment so I don't have a garage I can strip the car and leave parts hanging around for extended amounts of time.
I have done some small things on my car as long as it doesn't require me getting under the vehicle.

Here is my two cents:


I am not sure on your position in life currently, but as you said you live in an apartment and space or a place to work on a car is limited.

Insurance will most likely be cheaper for the Subaru - I have an '08 Legacy and the 'trac is about $10 more a month for the same coverage.

Maintenance items will probably be similar on the both cars as they are both AWD and turbo. However, the Alltrac would have 15 additional years on it and will most likely take a bit to get to the same level of maintenance as the Subie. Looking at the history you described with the Alltrac it is a gamble if you can just get the maintenance items up to snuff without any major work.

I think in the end it really depends on the motivation that you have with purchasing either car. For me, my emotional side would go with the Alltrac while my logical and economical side would go with the Subie.

If you have a dedicated DD that is not either of the cars, I would vote for the Alltrac.

I have driven both cars (I love the looks of the Foresters ) and for the sheer driving experience the Alltrac won. The Alltrac may not be as fast, but it handles much better IMO. In terms of aftermarket the Subie has a better aftermarket base.


-Terracar

Bias says get the alltrac.

But in reality, just depends on your financial situation. You will have alot of work to probably do to the trac to get it up to date. Until you go check the car, assume the motor has a rod knock and it will need a new motor or rebuild.

If your looking to replace the acura, get the subie as it would be a better DD out the box due to age.

Sounds like the Celica might not be right for you. Perhaps holding out for something cleaner is the better option if you can't or don't have the space to bring it up to par. One thing i've always noticed though when getting into cars that have a dedicated following, people are always willing to help out! Get the Celica and i'm sure you'll run into a few people with garage access willing to help you sort out the issues over a couple of beers. I would!!

One thing I would just take note of here is that if you're worried about the cost of insurance, perhaps a modified car isn't in your near future. Not to say it isn't possible to work it out on a budget, because it is, i'm just thinking of the headaches you'll face trying to get a celica to and hold 350 whp like you "would be happy with". Some people don't understand the logistics of building a car to double or triple the horses to the wheels. Sounds like you at least have a clue which is good. Not being able to work under your car is going to be a problem if you want that kind of power. Out of the box power is probably more right for you, but at a higher total cost w/insurance no doubt. Tough spot to be in.

I agree with all of the above, if you don't have the means or the time to have a shop fix up a bunch of stuff on the Alltrac (since you live in an apartment) then I'd get the Forester.

ellover009":1v1dki4z said:

not been modded un-tasteful with cheesy wheels

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Considering wheels are one of the easiest things to change on a car, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you seem like one of the people who would find an Alltrac more of a headache than a fun challenge when it breaks.

"retro looks" lol People always ask me if mine is a new model.

I think there's a small chance it could be a money sink

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*giggle*

I wouldn't touch it if it has knock. Really for any reason regardless of how simple a proposed fix is.

I would keep the Acura until you can afford to buy a nicer Alltrac. I do like the Forrester's too though. But an All-trac should be more fun / way cooler.

-Towels

the alltrac IS a project car. Its 20+ years old, Its had problems, It cant be depended on.
Id even be weary of buying a pristine one under 100k with history of no problems just based on age alone.
The truth is, every one of our cars needs a complete teardown/restoration if we want them to last another 20 years.
alltracs are MONEY PITS.

that being said Im never letting mine go

I just saw a beautifully modified 2003 G35 sell for less than what I've spent on my RC so far

But I wouldn't have anywhere near as much fun driving or owning a G35 so I guess I'm okay with that haha

zero06":ls8ktjz3 said:

alltracs are MONEY PITS.

that being said Im never letting mine go

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+1

i bought a second one because my project on the other one was taking so long that i wanted to drive it!! haha

Ok so I called the owner of the alltrac, he bought the car a few months ago from someone else, the oil pump was/went bad to he blew the engine, it's not what I thought that it was some kid doing something stupid to it. He put in a jdm rebuilt engine his friend had, eagle rods and some other things, I think radiator is new, rear seal, he says the ping shows up after driving the car for 15-20 mins and eventually stalls. New rear slotted rotors, he says hes going to thinker with it this weekend, he things it's a timing issue, he says hes worked doing diagnostic at garages in the past and has been having less time off recently, had to sell his bike when he did the trans. Interior is black leather but there are rips on driver's seat, it's worn, might need to be redone. How much does it cost to have a seat redone on one of these bad boys?
Outlook is starting to look a bit more positive, I will talk some more with him this weekend when he has time to work on it providing car has not sold or issue has not been resolved.

I've had quotes from 3-600 per seat. DEPENDING on materials it can carry greatly.

The car does not have a catalyst converter, I live in MASS, how much would it usually cost to get it back in spec be re-adding the cat? and is there any chance the system could start throwing error codes because of it? I hate how strict MASS is.

Anything else I need to check in MA so that it would pass inspection? so far I know they visually check the cat, on older cars it's more of suspension and accessories, and no engine lights. Is there any difference between a cheaper and a performance cat, or are they all the same?

Man, I don't know what you guys do to your cars, but I've had three and mine have all been pretty reliable (*knock on rubber*).

It's not us, it's the previous owners

underscore":1tcbhumc said:

It's not us, it's the previous owners

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I SECOND THIS!

The only problems I have ever had (that weren't caused specifically by me) were an exedy clutch vomiting its springs everywhere. Definitely get a compression test done. It might be cheaper to get some nice, smart aftermarket seats than redo the old ones. There are nice reclinable seats that look great, are safety rated and are not horrible bucket seats.

If you want lots of power, the alltrac takes a LOT of work. The forester is ok but is isn't the easiest base to work from and it weights a lot. Some of the wrx parts can be used, in some cases you need to do custom work due to the different chassis- front mount intercooler, exhaust etc. I would save for a car which does meet your performance requirement or at least is a lot closer and only requires simple bolt on mods like intake, exhaust, slight boost increase, maybe even intercooler. Once you get into new turbo's, manifolds, cams, ecu's, fuel systems it all goes downhill sharply from there. $10k later and it still isn't how you want it.

Performance cats tend to flow better.

Yeah, so would 250-275hp more realistic? Only other car I like more than the all-trac is the older Nissan Skylines, and that's still a few more years before you can legally import an R32 and jump through some hoops or if you have the money to make things happen a Motorex skyline, but when your paying that much you might as well save up for a gtr.
Besides the other stuff I talked about my other concern atm is getting it legal to drive in MA, so far it's gonna need a cat, and I can't think of anything else but they might give me a tough time about the cold air intake. I am still talking to the guy about the car, probably gonna go check it out this weekend after he has time to adjust the timing belt since it's 3 degrees off, hopefully that will fix the issue, I think he mentioned that after 15mins the car want's to stall out, could that be related to timing?

I'm doing as much research as I can before I jump into it since the car is in a state where it's not required to be insured and more loose emission laws.
I got some quotes from different auto insurance companies online, but I am gonna have to find my insurance statement to see all the coverage I have because they start talking about different types of collision coverage, medical and such and it's a pia since I would have to make sure they all match and reassess what I can lower in coverage and what I need to keep.