Page 8 of 10

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:46 pm
by CMS-GT4
I wonder if that code really has anything to do with theh rear lsd. I have a feeling the whole code is just a gearbox code, and anything with a 151 is standard with lsd.

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 8:44 pm
by evo
i remember seeing a link from a 4x4 site regarding identification of differential:

http://toyota.off-road.com/toyota/artic ... ?id=274535

734 does fit into their chart, but 737 does not

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:23 pm
by CMS-GT4
So we have to find a door with 737 and 150. That is the only way I think we might verify that code tells us anything about a rear lsd.

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 10:33 pm
by Razzo
well im in the middle of trying to figure what my rear end has. Its a early production model 89 but a 5th gen. Its JDM so its narrow body, 2 pot brakes, etc. I've heard that most jdm models came with an lsd? i'm really crossing the fingers that only alltracs came with the open diff.

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:43 am
by eddie_gt4
CMS-GT4 wrote:So we have to find a door with 737 and 150. That is the only way I think we might verify that code tells us anything about a rear lsd.


you don't have to find anything... it's just under your nose :D
at least EDM ST185's have a VIN plate (just under the hood) with all needed info :smokes:

I've posted it in other thread:
VIN plate pic

SouthernViking, I guess that "E150F-734" is a tranny & diff code of some (all?) "pre-facelifted" JDM ST185's :oops:
but whether 734 = viscous LSC or Torsen, I don't know :shrug:

btw, other sources on i-net also mention such code...
jus go google with a "E150F-734"

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 11:48 pm
by TomsGT4
Ok, lets make this interesting.

First off, we're not talking about viscous coupled diffs, we're trying to find out if our differential is open type or a limited slip torsen.

Second, if you see the post on the 4th page of this thread, 3rd picture, you'll read that "the torque sensing LSD is an option on the All-Trac/4WD models". Which means that this could be either factory or dealer installed. I'm not sure if the dealer would perform such an install at the time on a brand new vehicle, but if they did than that pretty much shoots to hell any hope that a vehicle identification plate will help.

Third, I think that Josh's post from the other thread:
CMS-GT4 wrote:Ok, so I have been doing some reading and I want to test out if this is a method to determine if you have lsd w/o opening the case.

I need a volunteer who knows they have a torsen in the rear and a volunteer of a known open lsd.

We need to try TEST 2. If this works, this might be a great help to the community.

How can you tell it's a TORSEN?
Well I'm no expert but there were a few obvious traits - stock Toyota diffs are TORSEN or open wheel - sometimes a diff might be changed internally with a mechanical action diff. TRD or CUSCO etc - When Juzza got his diff he scored one of these diffs by accident, on sharp slow turns the inside wheel chirps and squeals a little bit as it tries to keep up with the outside wheel - a TORSEN diff is super smooth. Anyway on the wrecker showroom floor the TORSEN diff has differences to an open wheel diff. With a TORSEN LSD on a workshop floor there are a couple of tests to do.

First is the spin one axle and the other axle spins same way - Torsen. If the other axle spins other way then go to test 2.


Test 2
Spin the input shaft of the diff. One wheel will may spin freely with the other stationary. I can hold one axle still, spin input shaft and the other axle will spin free. If I try to stop the spinning axle with my leg, just let the spinning axle rub my calf for example - the axle I am holding still with my hand will instantly start spinning in same direction. As soon as any torque is applied to the spinning axle - torque is transferred to the stationary axle and they spin together. TORque SENsing.

A metical clutch type LSD or cone type LSD tends to spin both wheels in same direction the whole time to a degree. There isn't so much "free wheeling" as available in a TORSEN.
[/b]



...probably this is the best way to tell what diff you have.
Look at page 4 of this post, last two pics of that post. It pretty much verifies what is said above.
1. Keep the input shaft fixed & spin one of the output shafts, if the other output shaft spins in the opposite direction, it's possible you have an LSD.
2. To find out for sure if it's an LSD spin the input shaft, and put force on one of the axles in the direction as shown in the diagram (same direction the ring gear travels). If the other axle spins together in the same direction as the force you applied, LSD.

LSD

PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:03 am
by ion_four
The followiing is either a solution, of sorts, or just another question to go unanswered ;)

Does anyone have a rear diff apart (either open, Torsen or Viscous, whatever) from which they can take some measurements? I'd like to know:

1) Ring gear diameter, inner and outer.
2) Number of teeth on ring gear
3) Number of teeth on pinion gear
4) Width from outside of one carrier bearing to the next.

I'd like to know this, without ripping my car apart, because I have a Toyota LSD in my garage (not from an All-trac) which looks to be about the same size. I'm curious if this, or something else, might be an option for us.

PM me if you have this info. Otherwise, it'll be a while before I do it myself, since I just changed my diff oil :-P

PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:52 am
by Toxygene
So I am curious. One time I had all my axles replaced and while the shop had my car in the air, they turned it on and put it in gear. All my wheels were spinning in opposite directions. Would that tell me anything about if I have an LSD in my car?

I don't think I have any other way of finding out other than ripping parts apart since the previous owner did some extensive mods to the car and I don't have a list of all of them.

Thanks!

PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:54 pm
by CMS-GT4
See the torsen test thread I started.

http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic ... highlight=

PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:43 pm
by ion_four
Toxygene wrote:So I am curious. One time I had all my axles replaced and while the shop had my car in the air, they turned it on and put it in gear. All my wheels were spinning in opposite directions. Would that tell me anything about if I have an LSD in my car?

I don't think I have any other way of finding out other than ripping parts apart since the previous owner did some extensive mods to the car and I don't have a list of all of them.

Thanks!


In a nutshell, that suggests you have an open rear diff. However, I have a clutch-type LSD on another car and if I spin the input shaft, the wheels turn in opposite directions, IIRC, but if I turn one of the outputs, the other output turns in the same direction, especially if resistance is applied to the other output...I think it might just be wearing out, though :-P

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:07 pm
by CMS-GT4
Here is a pic of my plug. I am going to look for a scope in hopes of seeing some helical gears.

Image

PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 10:29 am
by BriinumsBo
after reading about 5 discussions on alltrac.net about torsen, i guess nobody knows nothing about how to identify them. While everybody thought Torsen is when the box code reads 151F/767, someone comes op that 737 is torsen. wtf.
anyway i have european version, 767-151f, non-CS. I want to replace the oil and i`d like to believe i have Torsen.
If i turn the rear wheel, the other turns slowly the oposite direction..

what gear oil should i use? is synthetic motul 80w-90 ok ? (synergy or gear, does the name matter?)

PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 4:56 pm
by Gary ST165
this is a jdm ST185 RC

Image

Image


i swear it reads E151F 764 (TorSen) not 767?

PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 5:55 pm
by BriinumsBo
what the hell... :shock:

PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 6:00 pm
by Tazka
hmm...So now there's no more theory to which cars have torsen and wich have not...interesting.