Project-Heartbreaker 215/205 mash up

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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Sat Apr 05, 2014 2:05 am

[attachment=-1]uploadfromtaptalk1396666641961.jpg[/attachment]
I bought a stock head unit from another member.. Turns out it was from a 93 mr2 with premium sound.. Luckily the amount of pins used is the same, after looking around or seems the st 20x and this unit have the identical 15 pin connector and even the same pinouts. I just took the oem pins out and wrapped them and plugged accordingly. Looks stock. I also found a 93 gts shifter assembly which makes for a legit short throw. Plus i cut off an inch from the top.
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'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Sat Apr 05, 2014 2:12 am

[attachment=-1]uploadfromtaptalk1396667211484.jpg[/attachment][attachment=-1]uploadfromtaptalk1396667325338.jpg[/attachment][attachment=-1]uploadfromtaptalk1396667403400.jpg[/attachment]
You can see the shorter throw
Stock looking cd player. And trust me when I say one towered over this harness and 185/205 schematics looking for flaws, everything is perfect. I'm just going to assume it's a part broken now.
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uploadfromtaptalk1396667211484.jpg
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Sat Apr 05, 2014 3:15 am

I almost forgot i installed my ss brakes and clutch line, i ordered a new slave cylinder as well because mine is leaking, sold with new led's for the climate control and a downpipe stay bracket from amazon. Interior should be back together in a week and under the hood should be sorted this weekend.

I cut up my intake pipe and routed the iac and pcv in proper locations and added insulation to the inside of the cold air box so to deaden sound and keep air cool... Also with this last revision of the harness i cleared the fuse box to make it to the top side of the air box. So i may scratch the fuse relocation for now.
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Sat Apr 05, 2014 3:17 am

[attachment=-1]uploadfromtaptalk1396671370581.jpg[/attachment][attachment=-1]uploadfromtaptalk1396671441276.jpg[/attachment]
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'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Fri Apr 18, 2014 11:27 pm

So ive still got the same issue ive had for years now... Here is the videos of it doing the start up idle and slow die fade. I dont get it... Smh anyone that has experienced this would be great

gen3 no injector ground #2: http://youtu.be/ri1RXbgwEYE

Gen3 swap dies on idle: http://youtu.be/UaBUAfpX3bQ
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby RedCelicaTRD » Sat Apr 19, 2014 2:49 am

Does it do anything if you hold the throttle open?
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:24 am

Yeah.. It instantly cuts off
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby phattyduck » Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:39 pm

Is your fuel pump resistor in place and working? Does it keep running if you connect the Fp and B+ connections in the diagnostic connector? Check power at the fuel pump to see what it is doing during cranking and right after.

-Charlie
'89 Camry LE Alltrac 3S-GTE - SV25/ST205 hybrid
'99 4Runner SR5 4WD 5VZ-FE
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:20 pm

I haven't checked if it turns off right after I'm done cranking with ig on. But it does function properly, the circuit open relay kicks it to full time during the start cycle and while key is on it stays on at low through the register, it has new filter and warlboro pump, plenty of pressure at the rail to. It pumps full power as long as ig on and the check pins are shorted...
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby creech_r » Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:35 pm

I am no expert by any means, but I thought the start and die issue was JUST the cold start injector working. I had an issue that was just about as boggling as this one on an old ae86. I ended up selling it and the guy called me a few months later telling me that he tried everything that I said I tried, that he was stumped. An old datsun z guy told him to clean the fuel rail and guess what? His gts ae86 runs like a champ now.
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:09 pm

Its a gen3 creech. And yes if i test and discover there is an injector pulse i will clean the rail and injectors.
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby phattyduck » Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:37 pm

soarer.jzz30 wrote:It pumps full power as long as ig on and the check pins are shorted...
But the engine still dies? Hmmmm...

The gen3 swap dies at idle video is marked as private - switch it to public so we can see. :)

From your other video - where is your MAP sensor? Its not in the normal spot on the firewall...

-Charlie
'89 Camry LE Alltrac 3S-GTE - SV25/ST205 hybrid
'99 4Runner SR5 4WD 5VZ-FE
Previous: '88 Camry LE Alltrac 3S-GE BEAMS, '90 Camry 3S-GTE, '90 Camry DX
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:56 pm

The map sensor is in there, in the video i believe it was near the igniter and coil. I recently hid it though near where the charcoal can used to be, wouldn't even matter if it wasnt there, only the dizzy and igniter are used for start up. Im going to get out there and check again for injector pulse and fuel pump voltage at different conditions
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:08 am

After some careful testing of the circuit open relay and fuel pump relay... Ive got issues to resolve this week.. Well report much later tonight
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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Re: Build ST-185-0004608 (another gen3 swap)

Postby soarer.jzz30 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:23 am

SO today I checked the operation of the fuel pump IOEO and starting. I found that the fuel pump relay never switches from high voltage to low through the resistor...
When cranking it does get normal full voltage and when it is pinned in the check connector it also has full power, although it has some sort of firing capabilities it never switches to the low voltage mode.

Now, there is a few operations that are supposed to happen to transition from start up to running. Just to be clear the fuel pump should never be running with just the key on, only in start up or runnning mode. The circuit open relay is a safety feature so you dont burn to death in a crash so it turns off the pump when NE signal generation is lost.
The FC signal to the COR is actually directly connected to the NE signal ran through a transistor to a ground for the FC signal to complete the circuit... The FPR ground is activated then the ecu senses the NE signal without the STA, since the fuel pump relay is naturally in the full on mode, the FPR signal changes the relay to low voltage mode

I am going to head out tonight and check the ground signals from the FC and FPR for operation. I will also use a jumper and an LED and check to see if I get any fuel injector pulse, if I find that there is no fuel pulse I will also check spark while cranking. To get spark and tach function without fuel pulse perhaps leads to a faulty distributor or possibly pinned wrong (but I doubt it I triple checked)
I did check resistance between poles on the dizzy as stated by the 205 manual and it seemed to spec, but if the two gears are now turning, or the pickups are bad it would not function properly.

I have a guy lined up so I can buy a known working 205 dizzy and igniter but I'd like to be sure that is the direction of the problem before i drop any cash on it. If I confirm everything is right again, and those two don't fix it I will have to buy another ECU and hope that's the issue.

meanwhile I am going to go through and check resistance and voltage values for anything listed in the efi section of the 205 bgb and compare to mine to see what is there.

Another thing, none of the sensors actually are needed for start up, just the dizzy coil and igniter, every other sensor is used to control injector duration, even the igniter is responsible for dwell. So they wouldn't be a cause of a no start like I'm getting.. a crappy start yes.
'97 Toyota Soarer 5speed(dd), '90 ST185(money pit)
my build thread: http://alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=38003
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