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Just got a T3/T04B turbo, what do I need for Fuel?
- Thread starter GT4TOY
- Start date
gearhead313":3rs0beg5 said:yippie for online calculators..... get out and actually do it.
I have 780cc injectors thank you very much...
ill let you know what kinda of duty cycle ill be running when i dyno...
if you dont want to believe me i could care less... Im just trying to pass on some usefull information that other tuners have passed along to me
gearhead313
New member
Well, i dont know how different honda's and DSM's are...but that is what I know and have delt with.
I would like to know what duty cycle the 780's are at and what numbers they come up with. I just can't see how you'd run out of fuel around 400hp on 720's :shrug:
I would like to know what duty cycle the 780's are at and what numbers they come up with. I just can't see how you'd run out of fuel around 400hp on 720's :shrug:
If you know the bsfc of each, we can see how different
In reality, you should safely be able to make about 300whp on 440's, 400whp on 550's etc . It may require a little extra base fuel pressure, or a 2:1 RRR instead of a 1:1, but it is doable and better IMO to a point.
In reality, you should safely be able to make about 300whp on 440's, 400whp on 550's etc . It may require a little extra base fuel pressure, or a 2:1 RRR instead of a 1:1, but it is doable and better IMO to a point.
gearhead313":2oopy6ou said:Well, i dont know how different honda's and DSM's are...but that is what I know and have delt with.
I would like to know what duty cycle the 780's are at and what numbers they come up with. I just can't see how you'd run out of fuel around 400hp on 720's :shrug:
Zeus":1b4k3s1l said:gearhead313":1b4k3s1l said:yippie for online calculators..... get out and actually do it.
I have 780cc injectors thank you very much...
ill let you know what kinda of duty cycle ill be running when i dyno...
if you dont want to believe me i could care less... Im just trying to pass on some usefull information that other tuners have passed along to me
Word. 400 WHEEL hp on 720cc isn't that hard to believe. It's all about the base fuel pressure..
alltracman78
Active member
If ours doesn't flow enough for 550s, what about the 205 rail? :shrug:
Just as a different option.
Just as a different option.
AwdGte":1y052sto said:If you know the bsfc of each, we can see how different
In reality, you should safely be able to make about 300whp on 440's, 400whp on 550's etc . It may require a little extra base fuel pressure, or a 2:1 RRR instead of a 1:1, but it is doable and better IMO to a point.
gearhead313":1y052sto said:Well, i dont know how different honda's and DSM's are...but that is what I know and have delt with.
I would like to know what duty cycle the 780's are at and what numbers they come up with. I just can't see how you'd run out of fuel around 400hp on 720's :shrug:
300awhp i personally think would be impossible on 440's... the man to ask on this would be herman he ran 300 awhp... you can ask him what his duty cycle was on his 550's and see what he says...
i was at 80% duty at 212awhp
gearhead313
New member
it has to be the drivetrain loss that is making these low numbers. Honestly, im not very familure with the alltrac itself, im just using my previous experience in tuning on other japanese cars.
I just checked a civic i have in the shop now, and I am on 440's at 6psi, 75% duty cycle and the last dyno i had was around 245hp and the a/f was dipping into the 11's. I would bet at mid 90's duty cycle on 10-15psi i could make close to 300hp. Ive had no problems so far (knock on hard wood) with running very high duty cycles. :shrug:
do u know what herman's duty cycle on the 550's were?
I just checked a civic i have in the shop now, and I am on 440's at 6psi, 75% duty cycle and the last dyno i had was around 245hp and the a/f was dipping into the 11's. I would bet at mid 90's duty cycle on 10-15psi i could make close to 300hp. Ive had no problems so far (knock on hard wood) with running very high duty cycles. :shrug:
do u know what herman's duty cycle on the 550's were?
yeah thats definately a factor... mr2 guys have better luck... i think some guys fluked into the 300's on stock fuel... but no one recomends it
i think most of those people were atleast using a fpr
my buddies turbo rsx is running 100% duty cycle (eek) on 440's and i can gaurentee he is not at 300wheel... i think he would be the first to admit that...
i think most of those people were atleast using a fpr
my buddies turbo rsx is running 100% duty cycle (eek) on 440's and i can gaurentee he is not at 300wheel... i think he would be the first to admit that...
gearhead313
New member
its funny b/c it seems like using a FPR is something that isn't commonly done. I think its really imporant to get the base psi up and probably wouldn't try to get serious numbers without one.....maybe not though...
Im guessing that this rsx with maxed out injectors is leaning out? would u know what psi and stuff its at?
Im guessing that this rsx with maxed out injectors is leaning out? would u know what psi and stuff its at?
he was running 7psi but when he put on his test pipe it went up to 9 pounds
he is definately leaning out now... i think he said he was running around 12.5(a/f ratio) above 6500rpm and was getting knock...
he has now ordered some 640's to help this
he is running the greddy turbo kit with a hondata for management... it has the tdo5 18g turbo ect
he is definately leaning out now... i think he said he was running around 12.5(a/f ratio) above 6500rpm and was getting knock...
he has now ordered some 640's to help this
he is running the greddy turbo kit with a hondata for management... it has the tdo5 18g turbo ect
gearhead313
New member
Zeus":33mwo8oe said:he was running 7psi but when he put on his test pipe it went up to 9 pounds
he is definately leaning out now... i think he said he was running around 12.5(a/f ratio) above 6500rpm and was getting knock...
he has now ordered some 640's to help this
he is running the greddy turbo kit with a hondata for management... it has the tdo5 18g turbo ect
wow.. interesting. Whats the compression stock on the rsx? I never really considered 12.5a/f to be that lean :shrug:
12.5:1 is too lean under full load and boost, on pump gas, especially on higher n/a type compression. When I say to lean, let me elaborate ...
When you run high compression and pump gas (and increase boost even more) you throw more gasoline at the cylinder just to absorb heat and try and combat preignition and higher cylinder temperatures. The extra gas does nothing more than act as an absorbent to some of the heat from the high pressures. Retarding the timing (if you have control to do that) also is a good idea, especially around peak torque
When you run high compression and pump gas (and increase boost even more) you throw more gasoline at the cylinder just to absorb heat and try and combat preignition and higher cylinder temperatures. The extra gas does nothing more than act as an absorbent to some of the heat from the high pressures. Retarding the timing (if you have control to do that) also is a good idea, especially around peak torque
gearhead313":2uqqeo31 said:Zeus":2uqqeo31 said:he was running 7psi but when he put on his test pipe it went up to 9 pounds
he is definately leaning out now... i think he said he was running around 12.5(a/f ratio) above 6500rpm and was getting knock...
he has now ordered some 640's to help this
he is running the greddy turbo kit with a hondata for management... it has the tdo5 18g turbo ect
wow.. interesting. Whats the compression stock on the rsx? I never really considered 12.5a/f to be that lean :shrug:
gearhead313
New member
Ive seen plenty of dyno's where the a/f will swing around 12-12.5. Granted, its probably getting lean for some people, but on the edge is where you make the most power.
I think 9psi on an rsx that is starting with 11:1 compression will need more fuel. That is some very high cylinder pressures your starting to play with and i can see why its starting to pin on the top end! i agree....i would go with the bigger injectors to be safe.
I think 9psi on an rsx that is starting with 11:1 compression will need more fuel. That is some very high cylinder pressures your starting to play with and i can see why its starting to pin on the top end! i agree....i would go with the bigger injectors to be safe.
Being on the dyno, and being under full load in real conditions is not the same thing, or even close. I would recommend rereading the part about load, and about how cylinder pressures and temperatures need some of that fuel just to be a heat absorption buffer.
Where as you are referring to what you have seen, I'm offering this out of experience and what I have done/tuned
Where as you are referring to what you have seen, I'm offering this out of experience and what I have done/tuned
gearhead313":2x4tl8zm said:Ive seen plenty of dyno's where the a/f will swing around 12-12.5. Granted, its probably getting lean for some people, but on the edge is where you make the most power.
I think 9psi on an rsx that is starting with 11:1 compression will need more fuel. That is some very high cylinder pressures your starting to play with and i can see why its starting to pin on the top end! i agree....i would go with the bigger injectors to be safe.
AwdGte":2cqtepwk said:12.5:1 is too lean under full load and boost, on pump gas, especially on higher n/a type compression. When I say to lean, let me elaborate ...
When you run high compression and pump gas (and increase boost even more) you throw more gasoline at the cylinder just to absorb heat and try and combat preignition and higher cylinder temperatures. The extra gas does nothing more than act as an absorbent to some of the heat from the high pressures. Retarding the timing (if you have control to do that) also is a good idea, especially around peak torque
gearhead313":2cqtepwk said:Zeus":2cqtepwk said:he was running 7psi but when he put on his test pipe it went up to 9 pounds
he is definately leaning out now... i think he said he was running around 12.5(a/f ratio) above 6500rpm and was getting knock...
he has now ordered some 640's to help this
he is running the greddy turbo kit with a hondata for management... it has the tdo5 18g turbo ect
wow.. interesting. Whats the compression stock on the rsx? I never really considered 12.5a/f to be that lean :shrug:
I agree! which is why i said he is too lean!
and also why i said 12.5 is race gas territory... you def dont want to be running that on pump