Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Suspension and other discussion

Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby sleeper » Fri Mar 06, 2015 1:47 pm

Reviving this tread...
Did anyone make a new a-arm?

Would be REALLY nice to get one that is adjustable, and does not use normal bushings wich really binds up the arm..
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 2:17 pm

I am talking to racerx right now on building mine. Just waiting for some warmer weather so I can measure some parts before mailing then off.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby gtfour77 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 2:30 pm

Have you thought about modifying the arm to use spherical bearings? It worked really, really well when I did the conversion. Though I wish I would have my current TIG welder setup then...heh

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=25070&start=225
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 2:45 pm

I did think about it, but I have a damaged arm already. For the work of getting it done plus the cost of making the extended ball joint I can just have a whole setup made that will get me plenty of adjustability.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby gtfour77 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 2:56 pm

CMS-GT4 wrote:I did think about it, but I have a damaged arm already. For the work of getting it done plus the cost of making the extended ball joint I can just have a whole setup made that will get me plenty of adjustability.

Plus it's going to be a LOT nicer looking I am sure...:) Thanks for the shoutout on youtube by the way, I have been following your videos, keep up the good work! You make me wish I had my altar still! ;)
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:11 pm

Thanks. A shout out is the least I can do for all you have done for our chassis, not to mention motivating us to go faster.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby sleeper » Sun Mar 08, 2015 10:16 pm

CMS-GT4 wrote:I am talking to racerx right now on building mine. Just waiting for some warmer weather so I can measure some parts before mailing then off.



Hi.

Could you send me a PM with more info if you get him to make you something? Looking into changing alot of the stock parts myself..
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby eric thompson » Mon Mar 16, 2015 12:27 pm

sleeper wrote:
CMS-GT4 wrote:I am talking to racerx right now on building mine. Just waiting for some warmer weather so I can measure some parts before mailing then off.



Hi.

Could you send me a PM with more info if you get him to make you something? Looking into changing alot of the stock parts myself..




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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Mon Mar 16, 2015 12:56 pm

I'll have no problem passing the info along. So far its looking like 3 others besides me will want it anyhow. I had been horribly sick the past few days with a stomach bug and had been unable to work on this. I did read some exerts from some chassis engineering books though, but I still want to see what I can figure out.

My big confusion now seems to be ride height. I had measured a low milage 185 suspension height late last year, and I now have a stock suspension on my car. It seems that the stock suspension I have now is higher than the suspension on the other 185. So I am referencing the bgb for correct ride height. They measure from the ground to the center of the bolt in the LCA. I had been using the method from the center of the axle to the fender. Anyhow, in the bgb I found the fwd and awd models both have different ride heights. I also found that if I am looking at their inclination angle drawing right, it looks like our scrub radius might be something like 0 from the factory.

The big thing I have been trying to work up is the roll center. I now have a better understanding as why to correct it from what I have been reading, but I do not have access to the suspension software for plotting it and calculating it for me. I did from mention of some open source software, but no links so far.
I have the measurements that Adrian took here: http://corner-carvers.com/forums/showth ... 371&page=2
I will try and look over them some. I think the simplest thing I can do is try and keep the arms parallel in relation to the axle like they are or with the ground, but I am unsure of actual camber gain ect. The mono ball pin will be adjustable, but he is making it to fit out spindles, so he wants me to get it close to what I need as is, and the adjustment would be for fine tuning.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby bajallama » Mon Mar 16, 2015 4:48 pm

With a caster of almost zero, I'm not surprised the scrub is zero. They probably made it that way since the car is very nose heavy and possibly wanted to reduce the stress on the steering components. Do you know how to use any CAD software? We used that in college for FSAE to measure our dynamic camber, kingpin inclination, associated scrub, roll center and akerman.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Mon Mar 16, 2015 5:05 pm

I know how to draw in cad, but no functions beyond that. All the 3d I do is in animation software. I have found a couple of spread sheets with calculations built in for all sorts of suspension calcs. I am going through them to see if I can input my measurements and get some results.

EDIT: I think I figured out what I want to do. I am going to take my measurements with the car at stock height. I will then pull off the front springs and then put the wheels at the height I want. From there I can take measurements of the angle I want to go with and how long of a ball stud it would require to obtain that. I just ran across a drawing that made the angle more clear to me. Also, looking at Adrian's drawings, he suggests at 1.9" that extending the LCA .5" and extending the ball joint .5" would reduce the roll couple by 1.5"
I am curious though if the same length LCA can be retained and a different length ball joint could be used to come to a similar result. I do think I prefer the method of changes LCA length vs the long stud though due to brake and wheel clearance.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby MWP » Wed Mar 18, 2015 7:36 am

This guys subframe / arms are pretty popular. People are buying his stuff from all over the world.

Might be a good idea to model something of his work?

https://www.facebook.com/pages/RaceFab/ ... 13?fref=ts

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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby eric thompson » Wed Mar 18, 2015 10:46 am

MWP wrote:This guys subframe / arms are pretty popular. People are buying his stuff from all over the world.

Might be a good idea to model something of his work?

https://www.facebook.com/pages/RaceFab/ ... 13?fref=ts

Image


Went to their website and its exactly what we need. The castor adjustment on some of the arms they make is pretty sweet. I'm sure the cost is up there, I'm guessing $2k+ for a set of front arms.... and i dont know how different 165 vs 185 arms are if they or anyone can make a set that would work for both....

wondering if my car will be competetive has been haunting me lately :(
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Wed Mar 18, 2015 4:52 pm

I just checked part numbers for 165 and 185. The 165 has unique numbers for all its LCA parts. Seems even the 162 has different pn. I have seen claims of using 185 parts on them in the past, but I can not confirm it. I know the 165 uses a different sort of bushing than the 185.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby eric thompson » Wed Mar 18, 2015 4:56 pm

Talking to klue the rear bushing is different but if the mounting holes in the chassis are the same then one arm should fit both. As long as the ball joint shaft diameter is the same....
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