Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Suspension and other discussion

Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby sleeper » Wed Mar 18, 2015 7:32 pm

CMS-GT4 wrote:I just checked part numbers for 165 and 185. The 165 has unique numbers for all its LCA parts. Seems even the 162 has different pn. I have seen claims of using 185 parts on them in the past, but I can not confirm it. I know the 165 uses a different sort of bushing than the 185.



The rear mounting of the A-arm is different,
But from picutres, it seems like you could use a 185 arm on it. ( can try to get one and try on my cawr. )
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby eric thompson » Thu Mar 19, 2015 12:37 pm

I have a few members on alltrac.net that may be interested and perhaps I can interest some from GT4OC.net as well.

If we did a group buy how many orders would you need to move forward. How much payment would you need to start the project... 25%, 50%, full??

There are some differences between the 165 and 185 arms regarding the diameter of the rear bushing but I believe you can make one arm for both since the Chassis mounting points are the same.

There is a NZ based celica forum too.... let me know about the above info and I'll see if anyone locally is willing to participate. In the end it may just be me but I'm building a track car so it's expected...

Thank you!



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-----Original Message-----
From: RobJacobs [mailto:rob@racefab.co.nz]
Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2015 3:32 PM
To: Eric Thompson
Subject: RE: CELICA ST165/185 PARTS

hey eric

we don't do any at this stage but if we had a few people interested in them I could look into it. they would be $1200nz a pair and id need to find a factory arm to jig from but could make them longer to suit extra track width or more forward for caster adjustment

regards rob

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See above, my response to him and his original email below it.... So I guess we'll see what he says and go from there.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:36 pm

Just a heads up the racerx ones should be around 700usd for comparison.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby eric thompson » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:46 pm

CMS-GT4 wrote:Just a heads up the racerx ones should be around 700usd for comparison.


Sounds good but is there any more info on them? will there be castor adjustment? and since i'm a st165 my balljoint diameter is about 2mm smaller too.... let me know when possible.

Thanks!
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:30 pm

They will have caster adjustment, that is actually the whole reason I am getting them made. I need to be able to add caster at the arms as well as the top mounts I have. I was incorporating the ball joint because it is more cost effective than two separate components. Mine will be the first set he is building the jig off of, so we are just waiting on me to send him parts. The hold up will be me figuring out how long the ball joint pin needs to be made. If you guys can help me get a figure on that, it will speed things up.
BTW, he makes the pins in house, so what you can do is when you order just tell him your difference, and then send him one of your ball joints for him to take the measurements off of and he can make a pin that suits the 165. He makes a lot of LCAs for race cars but told me he does not list them on the site as many of them are low runs or one offs.
I am going to pull the springs off and put the car at the height I want to measure off of. I have a couple ideas for mocking up a dummy spacer for comparing the heights with the ball joint connected. But the faster I can get that mocked up the faster I can send him my parts to build the first set off of.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby MWP » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:38 pm

What size/type of heim-joint/rod-end/spherical-bearing is being used on the racerx version?
Good quality bearings that are up to this task can be worth >$100ea, and there is 6 of them.
If the racerx item includes bearings for that price, longevity could be a concern.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:44 pm

They use fk bearings.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby MWP » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:55 pm

Size, series / lining type, etc?

The RaceFab arms come with very high quality bearings, so im wondering if the price difference is partly because of that.
Last edited by MWP on Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:08 pm

I'll have to give him a call to find out for sure. Until then, here is an arm he makes for the mr2.
http://racerxfabrication.com/mr2_celica ... ntrol_arms

Here is a quote on FK's site on their lining. I know they have been using in US motorsports a long time.
PTFE Liners

F.K. Bearings offers self-lubricating PTFE liners on nearly all of our rod ends and spherical bearings. The PTFE liner is chemically bonded to the inner diameter of the race. The liner offers a very high load carrying capacity and has greatly increased dynamic wear characteristics. The operating temperatures of our liner range from -65º to 325º F.


EDIT: After currency conversion the NZ ones are 886usd. The logistics is what will make them more difficult.
Last edited by CMS-GT4 on Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby Sifu » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:10 pm

Interested. Posting for more information and updates..
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby MWP » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:10 pm

There are a huge range FK make from low-end industrial to high-end performance.
http://www.fkrodends.com/products2009.html

A 5/8" rod end is about the size that would be needed.
A FK "performance racing" stainless, self lubing 5/8" rod end is about $60ea.
So six of those is over 1/2 the price of the racerx arms.

I've had problems with low-quality / under-sized spherical bearings in 'quality' name-brand strut tops before.
Hence why i'm mentioning it. It is something you do need to be careful with.
Last edited by MWP on Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:12 pm

He likely has a wholesale account and does not pay retail for components.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 2:37 pm

So I gave him a ring. For the 165 guys, if you want a different ball joint taper/size you would just send him a ball joint and he can make you a pin to match. He told me he won't know the size of the bearings he uses until he has my arms to work off of, but he would guess a 3/4 bearing that is teflon lined. Looks like dust boots are about $30 extra. I am going with that option myself. The bearings will likely be QA1. The options I am going for are caster adjustment, and track adjustment. His approach will likely be similar to his FRS design.
I am planning on measuring parts today. I am going to try and get some angle ideas. I am also going to send him the drawings adrian made and see what he thinks of changes based on that.

EDIT: My first set of arms are expected to take 3 weeks or so to make.
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby eric thompson » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:49 pm

Ok. I may have an extra set of 165 arms w/ ball joints.... should I send them to him if I can dig them up?
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NEED ONE MORE FOR STREET:)
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Re: Front a-arm & suspension weight discussion

Postby CMS-GT4 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:08 pm

You would only need to send him a job joint for the taper. I was going to send him my arms. Sending him some data so he can advise on ball joint length.

Edit: If you chose to send him your arms you can. He is treating each of ours as a custom one off job, though he will use the same jig. You might want to give him a call and see if he is on the same page as you.
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