Road racing front brake pad life issue

Suspension and other discussion

Road racing front brake pad life issue

Postby fhalperformance » Sun Apr 12, 2015 2:05 pm

My circuit 93 trac has an issue with killing the front brakes at the track. After a half an hour at full speed the front brake pads are metal to metal with the rotor. Every time I go I have to bring brake pads with me and even them Im running around looking for more front brake pads at the local shops. In relation to my 91 mr2 I have been bringing to the track the brakes wear 1600 times faster on the st185. This is terrible in relationship to my circuit 5vz swapped mr2 (stripped, non abs) that only weighs 250 pounds less then the st185. With the mr2 I can get about 8 hours full out before the front brakes are metal to metal and more then 16 hours out of the rear brakes. It has reman calipers & aftermarket stock replacement brakes all the way around with 215k on the suspension!

I assume its from significantly more weight being distributed on the front of the car and the ABS still being installed on the car. I plan on eliminating the ABS in the next couple of months with proportioning valves so I can increase the rear brake pressure given the suspension setup in the car and how little work they do right now (nothing really). Its possible the factory setup is just getting too hot & isnt up to the task. I was hoping some people that track their car & have had the same issue will chip in.

Suspension & brake setup:
Weight distribution is like 65 something percent on the front wheels
Weight of car: 2960
Factory ABS still installed (not working)
New OEM calipers all the way around
Ceramic stock replacement brake pads & rotors
SS brake hoses all around
BC racing custom spec coilovers ( approx 3 x factory spring rates ) lowered 2 inches according to factory specs
Eliminated sway bars with stiffer rates
Volk 17x8 with 215/45r17 tires (soon to be updated)
Members don't see the above ad. Register now - it's free!
'93 trac - V6TT project.
'92 trac - RHD conversion coming.
'91 trac - 564awhp.
'90 trac - fab car/snow build coming.
'91 mr2 - parting out.
'00 celica gts - custom wide body.
'01 mr2 - crazy build in progress.
'04 ducati 999
'04 tacoma TRD - for sale
User avatar
fhalperformance
Club Member
 
Posts: 855
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:02 pm
Location: utica, ny

Re: Road racing front brake pad life issue

Postby eric thompson » Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:54 pm

They are just too small. There's a reason the st205, evo and STi all have brembo style brakes all around with large rotors vented all around too... Obviously not cheap but revolutionbrake.com has a bolt on wilwood front kit for under a grand... And a used set st205 rears bolt right up too.... You could try upgrading to some track pads that handle heat better but ultimately the small rotors will still overheat...
ST165-PARTS-RED
ST165-SCCA STU ROADRACING-(RALLISPEC'S ST165)
NEED ONE MORE FOR STREET:)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-RCuV_Hmqk (ITS miata 6spd,4.78 rear, shitloads of fun!! multiple wins and track records in 2014)
eric thompson
Club Member
 
Posts: 507
Images: 6
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:06 pm
Location: siny - 10304 / nj 07747

Re: Road racing front brake pad life issue

Postby aus jd 2703 » Sun Apr 12, 2015 9:02 pm

been there done that went to PMU HC+ pads. and got fluid fade using good (brand new) fluid with ducting aimed at the calliper. at this point you know there is nothing you can do with those callipers, simply not enough rotor surface are and mass to dissipate the heat.

I went the revolution kit and it works well only had 3-4 track days so far but no fade and so far good pad and rotor life. ive since removed the ducting and still no fade.

there are other options:
k sport, ceika etc heard good things.
AP racing ($4.5kAUD)
but also you could use other calipers (radial mounts are easiest) this means any brand if you want to put the effort in.
aus jd 2703
Established Member
 
Posts: 1089
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:02 am

Re: Road racing front brake pad life issue

Postby mkernz22 » Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:45 pm

Well your issue seems that you're going with stock ceramic replacements.

Try upgrading to EBC Yellow Stuff, it's meant for a street / track application.
http://ebcbrakes.com/product/yellowstuf ... rack-pads/

Or Orange Stuff which is a full track application
http://ebcbrakes.com/product/orange-stuff/
mkernz22
Club Member
 
Posts: 125
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2014 2:32 pm
Location: Massachusetts

1995 Toyota Celica

Re: Road racing front brake pad life issue

Postby klue » Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:17 am

IF your wearing out a pad and not having to replace a rotor. then its your pad choice. You need a metallic based pad, Highly recommend carbontech, K.beaty is using them and is very successful. Second to that HAWK hp+ and Project Mu are awesome.
facebook.com/xiiimotorsports
#xiiimotorsports ON instagram
User avatar
klue
GTFour God
 
Posts: 3893
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 9:47 pm
Location: Greater Toronto Area

Re: Road racing front brake pad life issue

Postby fhalperformance » Tue Apr 14, 2015 1:59 am

I was focused on getting the car back together and kept getting side tracked with group buys for trick parts the brakes were kind of last minute. I had good luck with my mr2 with stock stuff and thought Id see how they held up. I have run bigger brakes in the past on my other st185 but never spent any time at the track with it so I have nothing to compare to.

I thought some may be running factory style brakes as per racing series rules so I thought id throw it out there. I figured it had to be some sort of design issue with the size and such given the car isnt that much heavier then what Ive been running (again in comparison to a different car).

The first set of rotors were groved due to the brakes grinding at the end of the session. After the first brake pad change I came in sooner and let the brakes cool/checked their condition more regularly so I was able to reuse rotors. No brake fad experienced with dot4 fluid.

mkernz22 have you tracked your alltrac? Id be interested to know the difference in brake life with the racing/better quality pads. I am hoping to resolve my braking issues before returning to the track with the car so I can focus on other aspects of my build rather then running around trying to get my car ready to go back out.
'93 trac - V6TT project.
'92 trac - RHD conversion coming.
'91 trac - 564awhp.
'90 trac - fab car/snow build coming.
'91 mr2 - parting out.
'00 celica gts - custom wide body.
'01 mr2 - crazy build in progress.
'04 ducati 999
'04 tacoma TRD - for sale
User avatar
fhalperformance
Club Member
 
Posts: 855
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:02 pm
Location: utica, ny


Return to Handling and Braking

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests