Hub Project to make us wheel options (5/100 to 114.3)

gtfour77

New member
This WILL happen as I am really interested in some wheels that only come in the 5x114.3 bolt pattern. It might even be later this year....In the mean time both Josh and I are just too busy to tackle this for now.... Keep checking this thread. :wink:
 

CMS-GT4

Active member
So I was looking at celica.net for how to make a fwd gearbox from an alltrac box.

They use a hybrid axle with mr2 innershafts and alltrac outer shafts.

Don't see why it can't be done the oposite way. Use the alltrac inner shafts and mr2 or camry outershafts and the camry/mr2 hub/bearings.


See info.
http://celicatech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11171

1 - Get MR2 turbo inner driveshafts. You need axle with turbo and LSD if using the OEM Toyota VLSD diff. Otherwise, if using open differential or aftermarket LSD (TRD, cusco, etc) use the normal turbo axle. The normal Mr2 turbo non-LSD axle can be modified also to fit the OEM Toyota LSD diff.

12 - You need to make hybrid axles. Use the celica alltrac OUTER axles, and the INNER MR2 axles. The outer axles is those that enters the hub with bearing at the wheels. The inners enters the transmission to plug into the diff. You can separate the outers and inners axles by removing 6 8mm Allenkey bolts.

13 - Install the new alltrac/mr2 hybrid tranny. Use the celica alltrac shifting cables, use either electronic or cable driven speedo by swapping the correct one on tranny. Use 3sgte clutch/flywheel/pressure plate. Place the alltrac/mr2 hybrid axles.

It just depends on the diameter of the hub carrier. If the outer dimension of the bearings are both the same, we should be set.
 

gtfour77

New member
OK...
The camry hub (only 4 cylinder) will slide over our factory alltrac outer CV... The 4 cyl camry and 6 cyl camry bearings are the same but hub splines are different sizes.... The conversion would be possible if camry brakes are used. I would have already done that if I didn't have my custom Wilwoods. ANd I just got a new set of Hawl HP PLus and loving it! If I did the camry hub swap I'd have to fabricate new caliper brackets... I know, I am too lazy right now but this will happen soon.
So there you guys are... Other than some little details, this should be a done deal...
(This will work as I have both the 4 cyl and 6 cyl camry cv's and spindles... )
 

CMS-GT4

Active member
I already have a solution for the brakes. I am going to build my own set of brakes. If you select a proper 5x114 rotor hat for a 2-piece rotors you should still be able to keep your caliper bracket and shave some weight in the process.
 

gtfour77

New member
Great idea! Keep us posted! I might make me a new caliper bracket and finally swap the hubs later on this year...just to see if it really works. The bearing from camry are definitelly bigger and this would make an excellent upgrade overall...
 

CMS-GT4

Active member
It would seem new es300 axels on ebay are ~35usd each. So if you can't source cheap axels elsewhere here is a source.

I suppose the quick solution for front brakes would to use a set of supra rotors and a set of willwood brackets and custom calipers.

I am curious if any backspacing is needed for the supra rotor since one is using a different hub. I will report back with results when ever I attempt this.

I am still interested in converting the rears someday. I think one would use the same method. I know some rally teams used the same hubs front and rear. So it should be compatible.

The hard part would be rear brakes. Maybe if a 2-piece rotor is used, or if the supra parking brake is the same size. Maybe parts can be taken from the supra parking brake if not.

I do prefer the idea of 2-piece rotors all around just cause of unsprung weight savings.

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dl ... =&saprchi=
 

CMS-GT4

Active member
So I found someone in the celicatech forums who will send me a set of mr2 outer shafts.

Hopwever I had a thought. If the axle length is the same, and the innershaft mounting is the same as an alltrac, why could we not just use mr2 axels in place of the alltrac axels? Rather than making hybrids.

I will look into the hybrid method since it could be concidered more of a budget method since outshafts might be sourced very cheap or free from swappers and just note the axle method for other options.
 

Maloy

New member
Kyoto":2yqofia8 said:
real sports cars only have 2 doors

Beej, you know im not trying to pick a fight here, but that is ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT! If you want me to name names i will...

:)
A bit off topic but im with beej. A true sports car is a two seater two door.
 

CMS-GT4

Active member
Back from the dead. I took my brake project falling thru as a sign to take a different route.

I pulled out my old camry hubs to take some comparison shots. St185 is on the right, camry/es300 on the left.

I was curious what kind of work would be needed to swap the whole unit rather than just the hubs.

One note, if I was to do this, I could not use the suby sti rotors. The center bore is too small. These hubs look like they would increase the offset so I might be able to get away with mk4 supra rotors instead.

So far I am just noting a visual inspection. The camry hubs seems slightly more beefier.

img5140tl2.jpg


A: Where the suspension mounts seems to be the same.
B: The brake tabs are further apart. I The evo calipers might had worked on this.
C: Different location, connecting part may need to be modified.
D: Slighter different angle on mounting point. Not sure if that is an issue or not.

Bottom view.
img5141ey7.jpg


Top view, alltrac on left now.
img5142hz9.jpg


So, I am just posting for data while I am cleaning around the house.
I might still be better off just trying to swap the hubs in the long run.
 

gtfour77

New member
That's funny Josh, I was doing the same thing over the past couple of days.... I will have some pictures on Monday with my intentions... I really like the beefier bearings and 114.3 bolt pattern... The fact That I would have to redo the caliper brackets and buy new rotors and redrill them to 114.3 instead of 100...not so much...heh

Do you see any problem redrilling the steering stub hole (where the outer tie rod goes) and put it closer to the center of the hub? Do you think this could possibly work (be strong enough)? This would also mean quicker steering... this project is still in the planning phase so any input is encouraged...
 

darthripley

Moderator
CMS-GT4":1ve7g8ef said:
One note, if I was to do this, I could not use the suby sti rotors. The center bore is too small. These hubs look like they would increase the offset so I might be able to get away with mk4 supra rotors instead.

fwiw a popular brake upgrade for solaras & camrys is using the mkiv supra rotor with a caliper relocation kit (which used to be made by ericsol)
mkiv rotors with a different set of calipers should work just fine with modification of course.
 

Oteck

New member
Hiya im from the mr2 boards maybe i can help you. i'm doing an a$$load of research into putting big brakes on my mr2 and upgrading the handbrake to use the drum style (mr2 uses the piston push). I got splines that uses 30mm and 32mm axles. check your pm ;)

spline%201.jpg

spline%202.jpg
 

Oteck

New member
I wanted to discuss this with CMS-GT4 but i can't get ahold of him...

I've been messing the idea of swapping the spindle out of the hub from another awd car like the RAV4. their axle share the same number of teeth like the celica having 26 of them.

The v6 camry can't be realy used since it uses 30 teeth but the i4 version uses 26. You can possibly use the front spindle from the i4 camry on the rear but you will loose the service hole on the spindle for the brake shoes.

can anyone measure the axle hub end for me? i need to know the lenth of the threaded end and the teethed section
 

CMS-GT4

Active member
Sorry, I have been busy with some other projects lately and never on MSN msg anymore.

I posted a link about an axel solution to using the camry hub. The celicatech guys came up with using a hybrid axel from an MR2 and a celica to use the celica hubs on a 3sgte swap. I figured we could reverse the idea and put the mr2 or camry outer shafts to fit the new hubs.

My only concern is the outer diameter of the male side of the hubs, so they fit the alltrac bits.
 
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