Hub Project to make us wheel options (5/100 to 114.3)

Suspension and other discussion

Postby gtfour77 » Sat Jun 17, 2006 11:49 am

This WILL happen as I am really interested in some wheels that only come in the 5x114.3 bolt pattern. It might even be later this year....In the mean time both Josh and I are just too busy to tackle this for now.... Keep checking this thread. :wink:
Members don't see the above ad. Register now - it's free!
Martin V.
Toyota Celica Alltrac 561 SM
Toyota MR2 Turbo 35 SSM
[IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1201/4724980930_bae7a66436_m.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1405/4732468717_5fa2397872.jpg[/IMG][IMG] http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1068/4733097366_b4da49c0eb.jpg[/IMG]
User avatar
gtfour77
Established Member
 
Posts: 1075
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 2:50 pm
Location: WV USA

Postby Kyoto » Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:07 pm

real sports cars only have 2 doors


Beej, you know im not trying to pick a fight here, but that is ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT! If you want me to name names i will...

:)
Tim // Melbourne, Australia

1986 ST165. 152,000km on chassis
ST205 WRC engine / IC system / rear LSD with 82,000km
Blitz K1-380V
Apexi Power FC
Aussie 3" dump pipe to 3" catback system
TWM short shifter.
Whiteline front strut brace
User avatar
Kyoto
Club Member
 
Posts: 482
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:15 am
Location: Melbourne

Postby grip addict » Mon Jun 26, 2006 6:36 pm

real sports cars only have 2 doors and flip lights


fixed 8)
i need to warn everyone-
ATSAaron wrote:You specifically told Matt that "some kid dumped sand into my motor."

don't let some kid dump sand into your motor.
Image
grip addict
Established Member
 
Posts: 1229
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 6:13 am
Location: kansas city

Postby abraxxa » Mon Jun 26, 2006 9:04 pm

*GRRRR* :x
facelift ST205
User avatar
abraxxa
Club Member
 
Posts: 537
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 5:08 pm
Location: Vienna, Austria

Postby CMS-GT4 » Sun Jul 02, 2006 9:24 pm

So I was looking at celica.net for how to make a fwd gearbox from an alltrac box.

They use a hybrid axle with mr2 innershafts and alltrac outer shafts.

Don't see why it can't be done the oposite way. Use the alltrac inner shafts and mr2 or camry outershafts and the camry/mr2 hub/bearings.


See info.
http://celicatech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11171

1 - Get MR2 turbo inner driveshafts. You need axle with turbo and LSD if using the OEM Toyota VLSD diff. Otherwise, if using open differential or aftermarket LSD (TRD, cusco, etc) use the normal turbo axle. The normal Mr2 turbo non-LSD axle can be modified also to fit the OEM Toyota LSD diff.

12 - You need to make hybrid axles. Use the celica alltrac OUTER axles, and the INNER MR2 axles. The outer axles is those that enters the hub with bearing at the wheels. The inners enters the transmission to plug into the diff. You can separate the outers and inners axles by removing 6 8mm Allenkey bolts.

13 - Install the new alltrac/mr2 hybrid tranny. Use the celica alltrac shifting cables, use either electronic or cable driven speedo by swapping the correct one on tranny. Use 3sgte clutch/flywheel/pressure plate. Place the alltrac/mr2 hybrid axles.


It just depends on the diameter of the hub carrier. If the outer dimension of the bearings are both the same, we should be set.
Coldiron
92 st185 (205 swap) | 03 350Z Track (sold) | 13 Pilot | 17 Mazda3
www.noritoy.com | noritoy.deviantart.com | http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=19891
User avatar
CMS-GT4
GTSilver Member
 
Posts: 10336
Images: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: St Louis Area (IL)

1992 Toyota Celica

Postby gtfour77 » Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:37 pm

OK...
The camry hub (only 4 cylinder) will slide over our factory alltrac outer CV... The 4 cyl camry and 6 cyl camry bearings are the same but hub splines are different sizes.... The conversion would be possible if camry brakes are used. I would have already done that if I didn't have my custom Wilwoods. ANd I just got a new set of Hawl HP PLus and loving it! If I did the camry hub swap I'd have to fabricate new caliper brackets... I know, I am too lazy right now but this will happen soon.
So there you guys are... Other than some little details, this should be a done deal...
(This will work as I have both the 4 cyl and 6 cyl camry cv's and spindles... )
Martin V.
Toyota Celica Alltrac 561 SM
Toyota MR2 Turbo 35 SSM
[IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1201/4724980930_bae7a66436_m.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1405/4732468717_5fa2397872.jpg[/IMG][IMG] http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1068/4733097366_b4da49c0eb.jpg[/IMG]
User avatar
gtfour77
Established Member
 
Posts: 1075
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 2:50 pm
Location: WV USA

Postby CMS-GT4 » Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:55 pm

I already have a solution for the brakes. I am going to build my own set of brakes. If you select a proper 5x114 rotor hat for a 2-piece rotors you should still be able to keep your caliper bracket and shave some weight in the process.
Coldiron
92 st185 (205 swap) | 03 350Z Track (sold) | 13 Pilot | 17 Mazda3
www.noritoy.com | noritoy.deviantart.com | http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=19891
User avatar
CMS-GT4
GTSilver Member
 
Posts: 10336
Images: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: St Louis Area (IL)

1992 Toyota Celica

Postby gtfour77 » Wed Jul 05, 2006 12:59 pm

Great idea! Keep us posted! I might make me a new caliper bracket and finally swap the hubs later on this year...just to see if it really works. The bearing from camry are definitelly bigger and this would make an excellent upgrade overall...
Martin V.
Toyota Celica Alltrac 561 SM
Toyota MR2 Turbo 35 SSM
[IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1201/4724980930_bae7a66436_m.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1405/4732468717_5fa2397872.jpg[/IMG][IMG] http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1068/4733097366_b4da49c0eb.jpg[/IMG]
User avatar
gtfour77
Established Member
 
Posts: 1075
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 2:50 pm
Location: WV USA

Postby CMS-GT4 » Wed Jul 05, 2006 6:57 pm

It would seem new es300 axels on ebay are ~35usd each. So if you can't source cheap axels elsewhere here is a source.

I suppose the quick solution for front brakes would to use a set of supra rotors and a set of willwood brackets and custom calipers.

I am curious if any backspacing is needed for the supra rotor since one is using a different hub. I will report back with results when ever I attempt this.

I am still interested in converting the rears someday. I think one would use the same method. I know some rally teams used the same hubs front and rear. So it should be compatible.

The hard part would be rear brakes. Maybe if a 2-piece rotor is used, or if the supra parking brake is the same size. Maybe parts can be taken from the supra parking brake if not.

I do prefer the idea of 2-piece rotors all around just cause of unsprung weight savings.

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dl ... =&saprchi=
Coldiron
92 st185 (205 swap) | 03 350Z Track (sold) | 13 Pilot | 17 Mazda3
www.noritoy.com | noritoy.deviantart.com | http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=19891
User avatar
CMS-GT4
GTSilver Member
 
Posts: 10336
Images: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: St Louis Area (IL)

1992 Toyota Celica

Postby CMS-GT4 » Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:01 pm

So I found someone in the celicatech forums who will send me a set of mr2 outer shafts.

Hopwever I had a thought. If the axle length is the same, and the innershaft mounting is the same as an alltrac, why could we not just use mr2 axels in place of the alltrac axels? Rather than making hybrids.

I will look into the hybrid method since it could be concidered more of a budget method since outshafts might be sourced very cheap or free from swappers and just note the axle method for other options.
Coldiron
92 st185 (205 swap) | 03 350Z Track (sold) | 13 Pilot | 17 Mazda3
www.noritoy.com | noritoy.deviantart.com | http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=19891
User avatar
CMS-GT4
GTSilver Member
 
Posts: 10336
Images: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: St Louis Area (IL)

1992 Toyota Celica

Postby Maloy » Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:07 pm

Kyoto wrote:
real sports cars only have 2 doors


Beej, you know im not trying to pick a fight here, but that is ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT! If you want me to name names i will...

:)

A bit off topic but im with beej. A true sports car is a two seater two door.
88 white st165 (stripped down on jack stands)
86 AE86 corolla gt-s coupe
Image
Maloy
Club Member
 
Posts: 522
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 8:20 pm
Location: Seattle, WA

Postby CMS-GT4 » Mon Jul 10, 2006 4:21 pm

For anyone else interested in trying to do this as well, here is a link to a cheap set of hubs on ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/98-Toyot ... enameZWDVW
Coldiron
92 st185 (205 swap) | 03 350Z Track (sold) | 13 Pilot | 17 Mazda3
www.noritoy.com | noritoy.deviantart.com | http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=19891
User avatar
CMS-GT4
GTSilver Member
 
Posts: 10336
Images: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: St Louis Area (IL)

1992 Toyota Celica

Postby CMS-GT4 » Sat Nov 17, 2007 10:00 pm

Back from the dead. I took my brake project falling thru as a sign to take a different route.

I pulled out my old camry hubs to take some comparison shots. St185 is on the right, camry/es300 on the left.

I was curious what kind of work would be needed to swap the whole unit rather than just the hubs.

One note, if I was to do this, I could not use the suby sti rotors. The center bore is too small. These hubs look like they would increase the offset so I might be able to get away with mk4 supra rotors instead.

So far I am just noting a visual inspection. The camry hubs seems slightly more beefier.

Image

A: Where the suspension mounts seems to be the same.
B: The brake tabs are further apart. I The evo calipers might had worked on this.
C: Different location, connecting part may need to be modified.
D: Slighter different angle on mounting point. Not sure if that is an issue or not.

Bottom view.
Image

Top view, alltrac on left now.
Image

So, I am just posting for data while I am cleaning around the house.
I might still be better off just trying to swap the hubs in the long run.
Coldiron
92 st185 (205 swap) | 03 350Z Track (sold) | 13 Pilot | 17 Mazda3
www.noritoy.com | noritoy.deviantart.com | http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=19891
User avatar
CMS-GT4
GTSilver Member
 
Posts: 10336
Images: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: St Louis Area (IL)

1992 Toyota Celica

Postby gtfour77 » Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:17 pm

That's funny Josh, I was doing the same thing over the past couple of days.... I will have some pictures on Monday with my intentions... I really like the beefier bearings and 114.3 bolt pattern... The fact That I would have to redo the caliper brackets and buy new rotors and redrill them to 114.3 instead of 100...not so much...heh

Do you see any problem redrilling the steering stub hole (where the outer tie rod goes) and put it closer to the center of the hub? Do you think this could possibly work (be strong enough)? This would also mean quicker steering... this project is still in the planning phase so any input is encouraged...
Martin V.
Toyota Celica Alltrac 561 SM
Toyota MR2 Turbo 35 SSM
[IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1201/4724980930_bae7a66436_m.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1405/4732468717_5fa2397872.jpg[/IMG][IMG] http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1068/4733097366_b4da49c0eb.jpg[/IMG]
User avatar
gtfour77
Established Member
 
Posts: 1075
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 2:50 pm
Location: WV USA

Postby darthripley » Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:39 am

CMS-GT4 wrote:One note, if I was to do this, I could not use the suby sti rotors. The center bore is too small. These hubs look like they would increase the offset so I might be able to get away with mk4 supra rotors instead.


fwiw a popular brake upgrade for solaras & camrys is using the mkiv supra rotor with a caliper relocation kit (which used to be made by ericsol)
mkiv rotors with a different set of calipers should work just fine with modification of course.
Image
86 RN66 Hilux 4x4 Turbo Truck "Falcon" 22RTE
87 AW11 MR2 "Super 2" 4AGZE
90 ST185 Celica AllTrac "Vadar" 3SGTE
99 SXV20 Camry "Maul" 5SFE
Female Moderator
User avatar
darthripley
All Trac Goddess
 
Posts: 4110
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2006 8:09 pm
Location: dallas, tx

PreviousNext

Return to Handling and Braking

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baidu [Spider] and 2 guests