Tuning and Build help.

jensenni1

New member
Looking at getting a hydra ems and wondering if anyone out there has a few pointers on tuning. Ill be doing it myself because i really want to learn it. As for build help i want to get a stable 600-650 out of my 92 3sgte and was wondering if anyone could advise me as to what parts id be looking at needing. Optimum i think would be an 800whp setup and tune it down so im not running everything at 100% and frying it every few thousand miles. But hey who knows thats why im posting see if anyones got better ideas :)
 

4rsnduction

New member
Wow 800hp from a 3sgte.....fun times indeed.
First things that comes to mind is epic cam lift duration, 40psi with E85 fuel and a borg warner EFR turbo.
Maybe upload a pic of your deep pockets :lol:
Just out of curiosity why not get an AEM ECU ?
 

jensenni1

New member
4rsnduction":33loaos1 said:
Wow 800hp from a 3sgte.....fun times indeed.
First things that comes to mind is epic cam lift duration, 40psi with E85 fuel and a borg warner EFR turbo.
Maybe upload a pic of your deep pockets :lol:
Just out of curiosity why not get an AEM ECU ?

Deep pockets? Noooo just after playing with this engine ive learned to quite love it :) 40psi? SHittt ATS has a 650 hp mr2 running 20 something psi if im not mistaken. I was thinking optimum overbore and tune it off that. Maybe a twin ct27 turbo setup? the prospects are interesting...I would also eventually love to pick up and alltrac and throw the motor in there because im not too excited having 600hp going to a fwd gts....not a happy thought on tranny rebuild.
 

jensenni1

New member
Corey Darling":i1gxm7y0 said:
If you haven't seen Pat's or Trevor's builds yet, these will give you a good idea of what you're looking at.

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=21126

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=25459

A twin turbo setup would certainly be interesting to see. I don't think anyone has tried that before?


Corey

Im not sure if ive seen one either..i was thinking about mounting them close to side walls and running cones directly behind side intake vents to feed the beasts. Relocating the radiator and putting a fmic in its place to hopefully reduce turbo lag. :p Anybody use a Venom intake from a eclipse yet? Those things are badass and i think i might try a custom adapter to fit to the 3s engine...hmm the prospects.
 

klue

New member
jensenni1":25lj7wa5 said:
klue":25lj7wa5 said:
Tuning is not like doing an oil change
I thought that was rather obvious...

If your asking for pointers then its not that obvious.

Its probably better if you just pay someone to do it properly on the dyno.
 

jensenni1

New member
klue":2a4jush5 said:
jensenni1":2a4jush5 said:
klue":2a4jush5 said:
Tuning is not like doing an oil change
I thought that was rather obvious...

If your asking for pointers then its not that obvious.

Its probably better if you just pay someone to do it properly on the dyno.

Well i thought pointers was the reasons forums existed? i could probably figure it out on my own i was simple looking for a few tips or tricks for first timers. Its not like i was looking for a how-to on tuning, :p I know all software and hardware has quirks so it helps to know that when setting item A to the X value its usually best to not allow item C to go above Y value or w/e. Thats all :p
 

4rsnduction

New member
jensenni1":3oag3da1 said:
Well i thought pointers was the reasons forums existed? i could probably figure it out on my own i was simple looking for a few tips or tricks for first timers. Its not like i was looking for a how-to on tuning, :p I know all software and hardware has quirks so it helps to know that when setting item A to the X value its usually best to not allow item C to go above Y value or w/e. Thats all :p

Each engine is different, so each tune is different.
One person may use a certain value for cold start injection on/off point compared to how your engine likes it, or possibly you might need more or less fuel trim compared to other people when hitting the high HP numbers.
One person may say dont ever take your ignition timing past X* but you may find that you can go higher or in fact cant and must sit lower..
Tuning isn't something i would personally fuck around with...rather pay a pro to do it...and have the blood on there hands if it goes sour.
Think about how much time and money Toyota paid there top level computer engineers to design an ecu that can control the engine safely under all operating conditions....now try and do the same on your first time....
 

tubasteve

New member
^ agree

But things you do need.... 2wd makes the 600 range a little better.

If your going to try to tune,i would have...

1) Extra motors and parts for the motors

2) a working daily diver

3) moneyz

4) Trans

Also, those high hp guys are using 5$ Camry blocks to handle the boost, not your run of the mill either.


Some ideas/pointers.

-jr
 

Mafix

New member
what parts are you planning on using to obtain 800whp in an awd car? this is the list i'm more interested in seeing as opposed to trying to learn and use a hydra. which i have done and can give plenty of pointers. but i don't think you are certain what you are talking about. 800 awhp will be at or over 1Khp on the motor.
 

monkey8oi

New member
did i hear this correctly? you want 650whp on a fwd celica? wow.. won't you be spinning wheels thru third gear?

might help if you list your current mods to see what's needed to hit your hp goals.. don't think you realize the time and $$$ involved in reaching your goals.. and after spending the $$$ required to support that goal, doubt you'd want to risk blowing your motor by "learning" to tune... not to mention the dyno rental time needed for you to do the tuning... things that you might want to consider before you just up n try to tune your own car without experience..
 

jensenni1

New member
Maybe i should be a bit clearer. Right now as far as i remember i have, jun crankshaft, acr bearings, eagle rods, piston rings, ct27 with td04 wheel, new valves, stock pistons (if im not stupid they were rated at 650hp? so due to budget i neglected it...bad decision). My plans are to tune this build as is and run with it for a while. Then down the road when i have moneyz to take the car down and redo the engine in all aspects. New everything, complete cleaning and rebuild, the works. Thats where the goal of 650+ comes in. At that point id be having someone come tune it and traveling to a proper dyno.
 

WarTowels

Active member
Have you ever driven a car with 650 horsepower?

How about 300 horsepower?

With the parts you've listed I'd guess you could do 200-250 to the wheels. Expect to pay another $15,000-$30,000 for the other 400 horsepower.

-Towels
 

jonahs_3sgte

New member
im not to sure the factory front feed manifold will work well at 650 whp
IIRC reading somebody did a flow test and cylinders 1 and 4 run lean
so a custom intake(or maybe side feed intake) will be needed
not to mention bigger injectors
dual feed fuel rail
fpr
bigger fuel pump(maybe even dual pumps or a nice big inline pump)
exhaust
ignition will probably need upgraded
adjustable cam gears
bigger cams
98+ 5s block(would be ideal for thicker ribs and sleeves)
a clutch to hold the power lol

my 90 gts i swapped in a jdm 2nd gen
had the following mods:
usdm ct26(jdm ct26 exhaust wheel flew off lol)
3in down pipe
3in full exhaust
boost set to 12
stage 3 6 puck clutch
lightened flywheel
90 gts 5spd trans
custom front mount intercooler
225/55r16 bfg tires

i had absolutely no traction in 1st and 2nd gear even with my modest upgrades lol
lost a bunch of dig races due to this
but at the track i did manage a 14 second run

couldnt imagine 650 whp in a fwd celica lol but good luck
 

jensenni1

New member
jonahs_3sgte":8v30qu4u said:
im not to sure the factory front feed manifold will work well at 650 whp
IIRC reading somebody did a flow test and cylinders 1 and 4 run lean
so a custom intake(or maybe side feed intake) will be needed
not to mention bigger injectors
dual feed fuel rail
fpr
bigger fuel pump(maybe even dual pumps or a nice big inline pump)
exhaust
ignition will probably need upgraded
adjustable cam gears
bigger cams
98+ 5s block(would be ideal for thicker ribs and sleeves)
a clutch to hold the power lol

my 90 gts i swapped in a jdm 2nd gen
had the following mods:
usdm ct26(jdm ct26 exhaust wheel flew off lol)
3in down pipe
3in full exhaust
boost set to 12
stage 3 6 puck clutch
lightened flywheel
90 gts 5spd trans
custom front mount intercooler
225/55r16 bfg tires

i had absolutely no traction in 1st and 2nd gear even with my modest upgrades lol
lost a bunch of dig races due to this
but at the track i did manage a 14 second run

couldnt imagine 650 whp in a fwd celica lol but good luck

Well theres always dreams of course im just interested in seeing if it would be feasible to attempt or if id rather go chasing after another engine to mod. Ill be attending school with the ultimate goal of tuning ems and doing swaps in custom shops and id prefer to have an engine to practice and play with. The Celica fits it rather well i think. I have driven a 440 hp gxp before but nothing higher and yes it was a massive thrill. I understand the work and money required for a project like this, modding aint cheap. 200-250 is rather modest dont you think? its jdm to begin with...
 

jensenni1

New member
jonahs_3sgte":ivg46bdg said:
jdm 2nd gens are 225 hp and 225tq(IIRC lol)rated at the flywheel of course
do the upgrades that i did and you'll be happy

XD i would however....If i add that to what i have i might as well keep going :p. I may decide to just sell this one eventually and pick up an alltrac....The thought of AWD interests me greatly :)
 
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