The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby MWP » Thu Dec 31, 2015 4:21 am

aus jd 2703 wrote:gen 3-4 are very similar in oiling. yes you could make a moroso pan work, but you would have to swap oil coolers make custom lines etc and in all honesty the gen 3-4 is a much better design.


No, it wont work :(
To use a Moroso sump on a gen4 you'll need to use a gen2 or 5S oil pump. You cant use one of those as crank pos sensor is mounted on the gen4 oil pump, and wont fit the gen2 of 5S pump.

As said though, there is no need to use the Moroso sump on a gen3 or gen4 at all.
They already have very good sumps.
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby underscore » Thu Dec 31, 2015 4:46 am

Possibly a stupid question, but could a gen 3/4 pan go on a gen 2 engine?
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby msanders2 » Thu Dec 31, 2015 5:17 am

Yes it can, but you would need the gen3/4 oil cooler set up and lines.
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby UtahSleeper » Thu Dec 31, 2015 8:25 am

msanders2 wrote:Yes it can, but you would need the gen3/4 oil cooler set up and lines.


Could it? The gen 4 pan lower half is really small. Doesn't the gen 2 have a pan similar to the gen one that goes to both ends of the crank?
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby CSAlltrac » Thu Dec 31, 2015 12:32 pm

Why is this even being discussed? This would be undoing one of the better designs of the newer gens and taking the engine backwards, even with a Moroso. The Gen3 and Gen4 do not oil starve like the Gen2.
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby TRDTurko » Thu Dec 31, 2015 4:53 pm

CSAlltrac wrote:Why is this even being discussed? This would be undoing one of the better designs of the newer gens and taking the engine backwards, even with a Moroso. The Gen3 and Gen4 do not oil starve like the Gen2.


Thats all I wanted to know lol. I guess my pan is going up for sale. probably to the guy who just bought my gen2
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby msanders2 » Thu Dec 31, 2015 7:02 pm

CSAlltrac wrote:Why is this even being discussed? This would be undoing one of the better designs of the newer gens and taking the engine backwards, even with a Moroso. The Gen3 and Gen4 do not oil starve like the Gen2.



He was asking if he could put a gen3/4 oil pan on a gen 2 engine, which would actually be an upgrade not a downgrade. If anything, it makes it easier to change your oil. Which is a huge plus cause We all hate where the factory oil filter is located.
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby CSAlltrac » Thu Dec 31, 2015 10:03 pm

msanders2 wrote:
CSAlltrac wrote:Why is this even being discussed? This would be undoing one of the better designs of the newer gens and taking the engine backwards, even with a Moroso. The Gen3 and Gen4 do not oil starve like the Gen2.



He was asking if he could put a gen3/4 oil pan on a gen 2 engine, which would actually be an upgrade not a downgrade. If anything, it makes it easier to change your oil. Which is a huge plus cause We all hate where the factory oil filter is located.

:doh: Read it wrong. Thought he wanted a Moroso on his Gen3/4
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby CTechBlueDragon » Fri Jan 01, 2016 2:22 am

Yeah you can, I swapped a Gen2 block in place of a Gen4 on my 215 engine. Some of the mounting points are missing but it still works fine. I think the 4 12mm bolts are about all that's missing. Make sure you get everything figured out and dry fitted before you silicone it. I think at-least one of the 2 studs that allow you to put the Gen 2 oil pan on before you put the bolts in have no place on the Gen 3/4 pan; The other will need to be removed and replaced with a bolt anyways because it is too short to put the nut on. I only figured this out with my silicone all in place and my hands full of it, not a good time.
Oh and I forgot, also to get this to work I had to get a Gen3 oil cooler and hard coolant pipes because the Gen4 cooler will not mount to the Gen2 block but the Gen3 will... And unfortunately the return or feed or whatever it is on the Gen4 block is in the front and the Gen2 is in the back by the transmission... so I had to cobble together a way to route that around the engine on the timing belt side. it took 2 hard pipes customized and 3 hoses, plus I had to make the outlet on the back of the Gen2 block larger by cutting a damaged Gen4 water hard line and fitting it over silicone it then use an extension and hammer to flare the smaller outlet to hold it in place. Surprisingly it all worked great first try no leaks and has held up. I should have taken pictures. :shock:
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby msanders2 » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:12 pm

CTechBlueDragon wrote:Yeah you can, I swapped a Gen2 block in place of a Gen4 on my 215 engine. Some of the mounting points are missing but it still works fine. I think the 4 12mm bolts are about all that's missing. Make sure you get everything figured out and dry fitted before you silicone it. I think at-least one of the 2 studs that allow you to put the Gen 2 oil pan on before you put the bolts in have no place on the Gen 3/4 pan; The other will need to be removed and replaced with a bolt anyways because it is too short to put the nut on. I only figured this out with my silicone all in place and my hands full of it, not a good time.
Oh and I forgot, also to get this to work I had to get a Gen3 oil cooler and hard coolant pipes because the Gen4 cooler will not mount to the Gen2 block but the Gen3 will... And unfortunately the return or feed or whatever it is on the Gen4 block is in the front and the Gen2 is in the back by the transmission... so I had to cobble together a way to route that around the engine on the timing belt side. it took 2 hard pipes customized and 3 hoses, plus I had to make the outlet on the back of the Gen2 block larger by cutting a damaged Gen4 water hard line and fitting it over silicone it then use an extension and hammer to flare the smaller outlet to hold it in place. Surprisingly it all worked great first try no leaks and has held up. I should have taken pictures. :shock:


And now you don't burn your hands changing oil :)
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby abraxxa » Sat Jan 30, 2016 11:10 am

I used my ST205 Gen 3 wiring harness and changed the connectors where required to the ones from the Gen 4 harness. The water temp sensors are one example as the Gen 3 has two of them and the Gen 4 just one with 3 pins instead of 1 + 2 pins on the Gen 3.
Adapting the RHD Gen 4 harness to my LHD Gen 3 ST205 would have been much more work.
I have wired additional sensors like the trigger sensor with new cables right into the Haltech.
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby JDMSD1 » Sat Jan 30, 2016 3:02 pm

4th gen 3sgte is the best ever produced.simple,good power,reliable.
Easy wiring.5th gen drips down in extras and no increase in power,wiring issues.
3rd gen still uses a distributor,
What modern turbo motor doesn't have accurate firing coil packs?
Somebody just needs to figure out how to tune these,I'm sure in japan they can.
I installed this engine 5-6 years ago,when dipfktweak was ripping off people making harnesses.loser.
4th gen was like "supposedly hard to wire"then.
later you find its the easiest to wire.altho I haven't tuned one,I've seen an ecu and harnass modded for tuning.so as usual it can be done.
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby warracer » Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:26 pm

JDMSD1 wrote:4th gen 3sgte is the best ever produced.simple,good power,reliable.
Easy wiring.5th gen drips down in extras and no increase in power,wiring issues.
3rd gen still uses a distributor,
What modern turbo motor doesn't have accurate firing coil packs?
Somebody just needs to figure out how to tune these,I'm sure in japan they can.
I installed this engine 5-6 years ago,when dipfktweak was ripping off people making harnesses.loser.
4th gen was like "supposedly hard to wire"then.
later you find its the easiest to wire.altho I haven't tuned one,I've seen an ecu and harnass modded for tuning.so as usual it can be done.


Wait, its easy to wire a st215 engine in a st185? I can't seem to find any info on the subject anywhere
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby CSAlltrac » Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:56 am

warracer wrote:
JDMSD1 wrote:4th gen 3sgte is the best ever produced.simple,good power,reliable.
Easy wiring.5th gen drips down in extras and no increase in power,wiring issues.
3rd gen still uses a distributor,
What modern turbo motor doesn't have accurate firing coil packs?
Somebody just needs to figure out how to tune these,I'm sure in japan they can.
I installed this engine 5-6 years ago,when dipfktweak was ripping off people making harnesses.loser.
4th gen was like "supposedly hard to wire"then.
later you find its the easiest to wire.altho I haven't tuned one,I've seen an ecu and harnass modded for tuning.so as usual it can be done.


Wait, its easy to wire a st215 engine in a st185? I can't seem to find any info on the subject anywhere

Very easy. Send it to WireGap and done.
http://www.wiregapinc.com
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Re: The truth about ST215 3sgte engine

Postby UtahSleeper » Sun Jan 31, 2016 6:05 am

CSAlltrac wrote:
warracer wrote:
JDMSD1 wrote:4th gen 3sgte is the best ever produced.simple,good power,reliable.
Easy wiring.5th gen drips down in extras and no increase in power,wiring issues.
3rd gen still uses a distributor,
What modern turbo motor doesn't have accurate firing coil packs?
Somebody just needs to figure out how to tune these,I'm sure in japan they can.
I installed this engine 5-6 years ago,when dipfktweak was ripping off people making harnesses.loser.
4th gen was like "supposedly hard to wire"then.
later you find its the easiest to wire.altho I haven't tuned one,I've seen an ecu and harnass modded for tuning.so as usual it can be done.


Wait, its easy to wire a st215 engine in a st185? I can't seem to find any info on the subject anywhere

Very easy. Send it to WireGap and done.
http://www.wiregapinc.com


what he said. Mine took a few weeks and 400ish.
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