Transmission Gearing/ Bellhousing

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Transmission Gearing/ Bellhousing

Postby bfurches » Sat Aug 18, 2007 11:55 pm

Hey there,

looking for a litte info on how the AWD is setup on these cars along w/ the gearing and bellhousing.

First off, how many bolts connect the tranny to the motor? By any chance is it an 8bolt setup on the bellhousing like the newer celicas and matrix (1zzfe/2zzfe)?

How are these cars geared? (im sure theres some tech sheet somehwere, just havent really searched)

How durable are these transmissions?

And finally, how is the output shaft setup to turn the rear diff? If someone could get some pics of the underside it would be greatly appriciated.

Thanks in advance.
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Postby Corey » Sun Aug 19, 2007 12:25 am

Hi, welcome to the forum

For gearing. look here

http://www.alltrac.net/specs/GT4Specs.htm

as for how strong these transmissions are, there was a thead about this a few weeks ago. do a search and you'll find it.
The early 5th gens [late 89-late 91] (right? lol) came with fewer syncros on the 2nd and 3rd gears. i find that if shifted just right on my car, they will mesh quite smoothly, otherwise there is a bit of that hump to over come. but no grinding yet unless shifting very quickly into second from 1st. the later model 5th gens dont suffer from this as much.

general concensious is that they are pretty darn good.

for the rest of the info,?? :shrug:

in steps someone with experience...
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Re: Transmission Gearing/ Bellhousing

Postby Simba » Sun Aug 19, 2007 12:43 am

bfurches wrote:First off, how many bolts connect the tranny to the motor?


3 "main" bolts and an assortment of smaller ones. I believe nine in total.

By any chance is it an 8bolt setup on the bellhousing like the newer celicas and matrix (1zzfe/2zzfe)?


No. If you're implying putting an AT gearbox on a 1/2zz, I can't imagine why you'd want to. The 3S is a far superior engine.

How are these cars geared? (im sure theres some tech sheet somehwere, just havent really searched)


Most all 185 boxes:

1 - 3.384
2 - 1.193
3 - 1.333
4 - 0.972
5 - 0.731
final: 4.285

185 RC box:

1 - 3.583
2 - 2.045
3 - 1.333
4 - 0.972
5 - 0.731
final: 3.993

How durable are these transmissions?


Synchros start to get unhappy over ~600 ft. lbs. Everything else over 700. They take quite a pounding.

And finally, how is the output shaft setup to turn the rear diff? If someone could get some pics of the underside it would be greatly appriciated.


It's well documented in the BGB/TSRM and elsewhere.

Lots of fast, loud things.
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Postby BoostedBlueToyotas » Sun Aug 19, 2007 1:45 am

4 bolts for the bellhousing to the engine. My transmission / transfer case is
in the process of being put back together. Actually it would be back together if I hadnt broken the bellhousing part of the case installing a bearing race and then managing to forget to retrieve the studs out of it before throwing it away.

Previous posts have most of the other answers. As for the output shaft, what are you looking for, How the center diff is actuated or the geometry in particular. Please dont tell you are trying to make a 7th gen into AWD :doh:
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Postby BoostedBlueToyotas » Sun Aug 19, 2007 10:15 am

OK, from new member forum I see what you are doing

http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=22770

You might look into the RAV 4, I think some people put the 3sgte
into those and its driveline might be a better fit (and easier to find
as far a floorpan goes). my 2 cents ...... good luck :)
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Postby bfurches » Sun Aug 19, 2007 11:50 am

floor pan should be much of an issue. In japan my vehicle was released as a 1.5 toyota w/ optional awd setup. On these particular cars, the awd setup was only offered on AT cars (which does not work for me).

Essentially what i would like to do is find a awd tranny in stick trim (which i was under the impression the all tracs came as correct?)

I think what is going to happen is I am simply going to make a bellhousing adapter to transfer the 3sgte case in.

Is there any way someone could get some up close pics of there case/ front diff. and maybe even a few measurements (as in length/ width roughly?

Thanks again.
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Postby Simba » Sun Aug 19, 2007 4:11 pm

Just drop a 3S in. It's a much, much, much better engine.

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Postby bfurches » Sun Aug 19, 2007 4:36 pm

^i completely agree as far as the motor is concerned, yet if you take a look under my first postn in the new members section, you will see the room is VERY limited to begin with.

Not to mention, someone has already mentioned that I would not be able to pass emisions.
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Postby Simba » Sun Aug 19, 2007 11:51 pm

bfurches wrote:Not to mention, someone has already mentioned that I would not be able to pass emisions.


If you can pass emissions with an aftermarket turbo kit, you can pass it with a 3S swap.

As for space, you're going to have to take a plasma cutter to half the car as it is to stuff an AT gearbox in there. May as well go all out if you're going to.

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Postby bfurches » Mon Aug 20, 2007 12:12 am

as i mentioned before, i do NOT want an AT.

they do offer the all-trac in a 5spd right?
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Postby Simba » Mon Aug 20, 2007 12:31 am

AT = AllTrac.

You can safely assume that slushboxes are the great satan around here in all respects.

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Postby bfurches » Mon Aug 20, 2007 9:54 am

LOL

sorry, hence the title bellow my username "newbie"

anyways, realisticly, i need the dimensions of the tranny...rough ones anyways. Surprisingly the case for my current trans is about the same size as a 2zzfe 6spd (give or take 2-3")...just to give you an idea of what im working with. I will throw my car up on the lift and get some photos for you.
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Postby SuperWhite92 » Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:33 pm

The E-series transmission is probably around 30% larger than the C-Series from the ZZ family. That's not counting the transfer case.
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Postby bfurches » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:19 pm

Ok, so some good news.

I just was wandering through the shop and found a 2004 rav 4 5spd that one of the techs is pulling the motor on. I took the time to measure the case of the transmission, and to my surprise, it only sits 1.75" further twoards the wheel well than my current trans. It came out to roughly 17.5" in length by 16" in width. the dimensions are EXTREMELY close. I am waiting for the tech to take the bellhousing appart so i can compare the bolt orientation to my current trans.
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Postby bfurches » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:47 am

ok, so from what I am seeing here, the 04 rav4 5spd has 8 primary bolts (in the same configuration as the celica bellhousing) which connect the trans to the motor.

Would i essentially be able to use this case and dif and install AT gears? What is the difference in ratio between the ravs and the AT.

Thanks
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