Running w/ 17s

Road race, Auto X, or the Drag Strip

Running w/ 17s

Postby MARLON1211 » Wed Sep 01, 2004 6:40 pm

is it better to run the stock 15s on a qtr mile, or just run it with my bling bling 17s.
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Postby GT4times2 » Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:18 pm

15s please.....Lighter than most 17s out there. Weigh your wheels if you can or care to.
12 Toyota Sienna LE
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90 ST185 Gen4
88 ST165 Gen3-The works
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+ Many other projects, under covers....
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Postby Guest » Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:51 pm

Actually my 17s are light, if am not mistaken a tad lighter that my stock 15s. Mostly am looking for is the performance.

Postby MARLON1211 » Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:55 pm

Whoow i replied to you and i see my self as a guest well mayb an error or something.
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Postby mtbgael » Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:59 pm

Doesn't matter how light the 17s are until they get a TON lighter. The 15s have less rotating mass, because the weight is closer to the hub. 17s have more weight further from the hub, so they will slow you down.
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Postby BraveUlysses » Thu Sep 02, 2004 2:23 am

What it comes down to is how much the wheels weight and how close the mass of the wheels is to the center. Overall, this is hard to measure, but most likely, the 17's are heavier in this respect.

The stock alltrac wheels are heavy as hell though, so take this all as you will.
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Postby MARLON1211 » Thu Sep 02, 2004 11:35 am

MTBgael, thats a good advice.
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Postby omgitsroy326 » Thu Sep 02, 2004 5:42 pm

yes it will be hard to messure the inertia of the two different rims, but you can take a look at the two and kinda guess and estimate which would have a larger inertia.

But if you take rod ... thinking that it's one spoke then ... also the rod is rotating through one end then the equation is I = 1/3 m* L ^2
or say a thin walled hallow sphere I = 2/3 M R^2... you can see that as u get away furthur from the radius the Inertia increases by some fraction time the radius or length to the second power.

So if you have R1 = (17/2) ^ 2 = 72.25
R2 = (15/2) ^ 2 = 56.25

this is if the mass and the design are the same then r2/r1 = 77% or 33% more inertia..

and if we take what mebgael said "The 15s have less rotating mass, because the weight is closer to the hub. 17s have more weight further from the hub, so they will slow you down."

then you can estimate and guess that the diameter for the 15 may be reduced to to somethin smaller and closer to the hub... while the 17 diameter stays constant. so that previous 33% different can be increased to say maybe 44%. I could be wrong.... but this is how i look at it when i get my rims.... I previously had 18 by 9.5 and it really screwed me up on my previous car... u really notice a difference.
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some assembly required...

Postby DKOV » Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:13 pm

I recently installed a set of 17s on my st165 Celica.

"Is that possible" you ask?

Sure... some assembly required.

I had these 17s on a different car but I needed a set of road tires to make the long trip to a Rally out of town (I didn't want to use up my super soft Rally tires on the pavement there and back).

The 17s were 215/40 in front, not a big deal. But 135/35 in the rear! No, they wouldn't clear the spring perch. However, they didn't need much to do so.

With some "light persuasion" with a 5 lb sledge, I managed to dent the sring perch just enough to allow the tire to pass by cleanly.

Now, nobody would go around recommending folks to "whack on their suspension with a huge hammer", but some precusion tapping with a punch can dimple a piece of steel without loosing the integrity of the part.

So now, I have that full wheel well 17 inch tire look WITH that rear wheel drive wider rear end look. Pretty neat actually.

The down side is, that I will only ever have those wheels on there for long, road trips to a rally. And even that is going to be rare with the new race trailer.

Even so... folks, it CAN be done. 17s WILL fit an st165 even if it has 235s on the rear, LOL!!!

I'll dig up a pic.


Scott "DKOV" Kovalik

Postby celicaracer18 » Sun Sep 12, 2004 8:51 pm

just wondering but if you had really light wieght 17s with some good tires couldn't you get alot more traction
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Postby alltracman78 » Sun Sep 12, 2004 11:19 pm

That's what the awd is for :D
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Postby celicaracer18 » Sun Sep 12, 2004 11:31 pm

yeah, forgot about that
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this is nuts!!!

Postby DKOV » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:22 am

Apparently THIS is the ONLY thread on this entire forum on which I can post.

My name and password works HERE and here only.

If someone reads this and wants to help out, can you post the following response to a thread titles "skid plates for 165" under CLUB CHAT...

Here's the question posted by TRDriver: "is there anybody that makes skid plates for the 165? if not, what do i make them out of and what should they cover and where could i bolt them up? thanks alot!"

PLEX replied that I had them built by Tap Plastics.


Tap Plastics did not build them for me, I built them myself but I purchased the materials from Tap Plastics. I then took them home and cut, heated, shaped and installed them.

All the materials I bought from Tap are High Density Polyethalene. I bought a 4x4 sheet of 1/2 inch and a 4x8 sheet of 1/4 inch.

The half inch is the front portion under the engine to the cross beam roughtly at the axle and the rest of the underside is coated with the 1/4 inch. Of course, there are special cuts and spacings to be made there too. And, the under plates have to be shaped to avoid catching any ground, road or excess amounts of mud and debris which racing.

Let's not forge the MOUNTS. Steel plates and mounts have to be welded onto the bottom of the car to accept the new skids and hold them in place. I bult my mounts to accept large button head, hex drive bolts that are tapped into the mounts and chassis. These done have a head that can grab debris or the ground and adds to the overall "slickness" of the kit.

Also, some consideration must be given to the exhaust line. Even though the PolyE has an extremely high flash point, it will melt if it sits right up agains the exhaust. I have about a 1/3 of an inch between my Poly and the down pipe in one particular place and it's got nothing but a little discolored. It's not really going to burn but it might get stinky if it actually TOUCHES the exhaust for a long amount of time at race pace.

The reason for Polyethalene rather than aluminum or steel plating is that the Poly is smooth and slick allowing the car to easily slide over any obstacles yet is strong enough to take the toughest of hits. Plus, the flxible nature of the stuff allows it to actually help absorb the hits.

Metal plates take the hit and dent. Then they are shaped that way. The next hit you take, then, does the damage. The poly, even if it is pushed in, pops right back out as if nothing has ever happened.

Those of you that have seen me run, know just how strong this stuff is!!!

If anyone want to drop by and check my kit out, I'm happy to share. In fact, I still have my templates and such for making more if anyone's interested.


Scott "DKOV" Kovalik

Postby PreGrid » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:27 am

Never mind... I just signed up... again. and posted there.

Thanks anyway.

Scott "DKOV" Kovalik
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Postby 2of81 » Mon Sep 13, 2004 9:10 pm

Acording to my Snap-on freon scale:

Stock ST185 15's----42 lbs
TTE 17's--------------41 lbs
Volk SE37A 18's-----40 lbs

All of these were done with tires
1972 Corolla TE27
1993 Celica All-Trac Red-205 trans,550's, ROM Tune,20G,264 cams.
1993 Celica All-Trac White-sold to Towels
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