st205 swap in 88 all trac! Finished, With video

krogers128":248lbx3c said:

krazy2":248lbx3c said:

krogers128":248lbx3c said:

checked the circuit open relay and that is switching like it's suppose to be. the fuel pump relay is not bad itself, if i loop a wire in two of the plug ins (female end of the fuel pump relay plug) the car will stay running. in my non professional opinion, i think it's either the ECU not telling the relay it needs to be turning on, or the relay itself is getting no power. however the open relay is switching which would be providing the power right? idk i need help i just want to drive my car haha. :shrug:

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I had to jump my Walbro at check factory connector to supply 12 continuous to pump.

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wouldn't that mean its constantly running, or?

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12volts constant with switch on. There is a sight that can tell you how to do it at the relay. (http://www.gtfours.co.uk/) under st165 modifications. Mine would drop to low and barely would idle. Walbro said the pump needed 12 v constant.

Ill look when I get home. Basically, I can just wire a relay up to the wires coming out the top of the fuel tank for the fuel pump to a relay? How did you do it

krogers128":1uyi7ons said:

Ill look when I get home. Basically, I can just wire a relay up to the wires coming out the top of the fuel tank for the fuel pump to a relay? How did you do it

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sorry i gave you the wrong number i pm'ed u my right one again. Im using a 205 wiring harness and on one of the plugs going into the car there is a wire which sends the signal to the fuel pump. if you have the EWD its plug IJ1 on pin 4 its a Blue wire with a black line (L-B) that interfaces with the B-L wire on the 165 plug in the same location of the car, which is a 2 row 20 pin plug. the wire which goes to the fuel pump from that plug is the L-B wire which is ACROSS from the L-W wire which feeds the ecu a speed signal from the gauge cluster. THIS L-B wire is at the start/end of the row. (NOT the L-B one which is next to the L-W wire which is goes to a radiator sensor on the 165)

This IJ1 plug is one of 3 plugs, II1 and II2 are the other two. What I did with these was interface them with the 165 plug. This allowed me to use the 165 plug and keep everything looking factory, minus the shrink wrap.

don't think i would like to costantly run my fuel pump, seems like a horrible idea lol. and thanks for all the info, but i guess i'm still stuck with how am i going to get power to my fuel pump relay. could it be the ecu not telling the pump to turn on? cause the switch on the open circuit relay switches when the car turns on like it should (if you look in the wiring diagram is shows the FPR connects to that switch, and it works fine). also the relay itself is fine. i just dunno anymore lol

on the 205 and the 165 the fuel pump relay is a double post single throw relay. The first post runs power to the fuel pump direct when there is no power going through the relay coil. This line is tapped in to by the check connector. The second post runs power when the relay coil is given power. This goes to the fuel pump resistor and then to the fuel pump via that IJ1 plug pin 4 (205).

So the fuel pump is always on its just that the ecu dictates whether the power is being ran straight to it or to a resistor which slows it down. It does this by running power through the coil on the fuel pump relay which switches whether the fuel pump gets direct power or power through a resistor.

In the st204's and the st162's the there is no fuel pump relay and thus no resistor. The pump is directly connected to the COR and thus runs constantly and at the same speed all the time.

Whatever the fuel injectors dont use is feed back via the fuel return line.

I know this because i did a 205 3s into a 204 and the clip that i bought was missing Junction Box #6 which is the box that contains the fuel pump relay and the IC pump relay (It was in the pic but somewhere between the warehouse and me it went missing)... In order to over come this I wired the the 204 up as it would have been with the 204 fuel pump. That is to say i deleted the 205's fuel pump relay since the clip that i bought did not have one.

WARNING: Doing this will result in the the resistor on the 205's ecu circuit board (in the ecu) to burn it self out.(plug A pin 16 on the ecu, this is the smallest 16 pin plug on the 205's ecu) I ran my 204 like this for 5 years with out a problem. In order to avoid this the FPR line must have a resistor in it to mimic the coil on the fuel pump relay which is not there.

My question to you would be if ur running a 205 harness or a 165 harness and what kind and where exactly is your fuel pump relay if you have one on the car.

In any case the fuel pump relay and its coil that feeds it power should be tapping into the COR off the gate/post/switch which creates a closed circuit when power is ran through the COR relay coils. This may be a different pin out depending on which COR you are running but for both the 205 its the pin that gets connected to the L-B wire on pin/post 1.

hope this helps and doesnt confuse

:? Daaa...... what the question again??? Just kiddin' Nice explanation, well done.

well i got a new ecu hoping that would fix the issue and it didn't, i really don't what else to do at this point.

krogers128":1vg1dgz9 said:

well i got a new ecu hoping that would fix the issue and it didn't, i really don't what else to do at this point.

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Test continuity between the fuel pump plug and the power line going to it from either the COR to the FP relay or straight from the COR depending on how you have the FP wired up.

Double check all the grounds

The ecu doesnt make the fuel pump turn on. With the 165's and 205's and im pretty sure the 185's (havent yet looked at the EWD for them yet) all it does is change the speed of the fuel pump via the double post relay so that one post routes power directly to the FP and the other post routes it to a resistor and then to the FP.

krogers128":25vjx6a4 said:

checked the circuit open relay and that is switching like it's suppose to be. the fuel pump relay is not bad itself, if i loop a wire in two of the plug ins (female end of the fuel pump relay plug) the car will stay running. in my non professional opinion, i think it's either the ECU not telling the relay it needs to be turning on, or the relay itself is getting no power. however the open relay is switching which would be providing the power right? idk i need help i just want to drive my car haha. :shrug:

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are you using a 205 COR and FPR or a 165?

what color wires are you bridging over? it has to be a blue black strip with either a blue black strip or blue white if ur using 205 wiring or blue black strip with violet white stripe or blue black strip if its 165 wiring?

looking at the EWD for both the 205 and 165 It looks like the FPR on the 205 is naturally closed on the post that outputs power to the FP with out a resistor WHERE AS on the 165 the FPR is naturally closed on the post that outputs power to the fuel pump with the resistor.

I would check the blue black strip wire from the fuel pump and see if theres continuity to the two post/wires of the FPR (post 4 L-B wire and post 1 L-W wire if its a 205 wiring/relay and post 2 L-B and post 4 V-W on the 165 relay)

At this point id also double check that the relay is the right one for the harness because the 205 and 165 didnt use the same FPR even tho both where STDP relays (single throw double post) Although i doubt thats the problem because the 205 used a 5 pin relay and the 165 used a 4 pin relay which uses the same power source for both the gate as well as the coil.

Then again im not sure how you wired it up.

My fuelp pump relay that came off my 165 broke so I used my own 5 pin 12v relay but wired it up like the 4 pin used on the 165. My harness was made by a guy on the forums, however like I said it ran for a month before this either but idk what's goin on and why it stopped. And the circuit open relay is from an st205. Blah, ill check it all tomorrow if I find time

oh yeah been awhile since i've updated, i been driving the car for the last two weeks. i don't really have any problems with the car now, except i am getting my wheel bearings done and plan on getting suspension in the next month or so, probably coilovers. car is only at about 8-9psi right now, and when i inquired about the mines ecu to mines themselves, i gave them my plaque number and they told me this about the ecu:

Set to run on 100 ron octane rated fuel.
Fuel mapping and Ignition Timing Optimized
Speed limiter cut
Rev limit +500 stock
Boost is set at 1.1kgf/cm2 (15.64psi)

anyways, im assuming the boost isn't as high possibly due to the octane fuel we have here? (92 is what i get) also when i took my mid pipe out, i went from 6psi to 8-9 lol. here's a quick pull of the car, going light on it, about 3/4 throttle and not revving to the limiter (which i haven't found out where that is yet) lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vD9OdgvJvE

Sounds damn good!

thank you, its just open from the cat lol. love the way it sounds

Don't freak out too much about the 92 octane gas that you run... The 100 octane rating that the ECU is tuned for is RON, the 92 octane you are running is rated (R+M)/2. They are different scales.

Read up:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating

That said, you are still a bit short on octane - just not as much as you thought.

-Charlie

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