165-KISS

nw94rs

New member
Honestly this was all done from 10pm to 4am, it's a miracle it even ended up working. Originally I intended/hoped to just plug the 162 dash harness into the 165 cabin harness. However there's a few additions in the 165 dash harness like the intercooler ecu & a few other things. We ended up just integrating the climate control into the 165 harness. It's only one plug.

You will need the 162:
Blower box & fan.
Climate control with both sides of the plug
The 162 & 165 dash wiring diagram.
 

nw94rs

New member
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Some hardware showed up today from Skybolt. I'm going to use these to hold my bumper cover onto my bumper. My car didn't come with bumpers and the rear 162 bumper cover I'm using doesn't fit the 165 bumper bar, & the 162 bumper bar doesn't fit the 165 chassis because of the the fuel tank placement on the 165s. So I'll be building some custom bash bars that should be considerably lighter than the originals. I'll incorporate some tabs to mount this new hardware.
 

polm

New member
That garage is simply amazing lol. I'd love to have that much space to work on cars! Nice pics, nice cars, can't wait to see progress!
 

nw94rs

New member
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Cut some carbon for my center console, I'll probably put something in there come spring time, for now it looks a bit more finished. So damn itchy, not looking forward to trimming my door panals.
 

MWP

New member
nw94rs":1n29kmxo said:
I finished the frp roof........then I saw that crash at pikes peak this year...

What makes you think that a steel roof would be any better than FPR in a crash like that??

In a crash like that body panels mean nothing, and the cage is all important.
 

nw94rs

New member
Steel would have been better than a frp roof or an alluminum roof for many reasons, while I'll agree with you that the cage is the most important. Having a steel roof keeps the debris out of the car. And usually the welded steel roof will deform with the shell of the car. What you saw with the evos alloy roof wasn't an issue of the metal used but how it's anchored to the unibody (glue/rivets). Fiberglass would be even worst as it would explode upon impact.

There's a reason WRC cars use the factory steel doors & roof skins.

And the cage in that pikes peak evo was shit.
 

nw94rs

New member
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Today I completed the passenger side of the plug for the door panal, I'm going to get this in primer and then begin making the mold. There's still a fair amount of work left on the drivers side. I think I may vacuume bag them. It's not a structural piece but I would like to become more proficient at the process.
 

MWP

New member
nw94rs":e3abwrbw said:
Steel would have been better than a frp roof or an alluminum roof for many reasons, while I'll agree with you that the cage is the most important. Having a steel roof keeps the debris out of the car. And usually the welded steel roof will deform with the shell of the car. What you saw with the evos alloy roof wasn't an issue of the metal used but how it's anchored to the unibody (glue/rivets). Fiberglass would be even worst as it would explode upon impact.

I think i would prefer for a brittle FRP roof to break up, than for a steel one to slice me up.

There's a reason WRC cars use the factory steel doors & roof skins.

... yeah, its cost cutting.
Nothing else.

And the cage in that pikes peak evo was shit.

Will agree with you on that!
They were VERY lucky.
 

nw94rs

New member
MWP":puwi5n4l said:
... yeah, its cost cutting.
Nothing else

There's not a single cost cut in today's world rally car. I mean the cars cost $750,000 & that's not even with a single spare, or the team of engineers required to turn the thing on. As far as composites go it uses Autoclave formed prepregnate carbon on the bumpers, fenders, and mirrors. Shit they use autoclaved Kevlar fender liners, It would be nothing for them to whip up a set of doors and a roof skin, it comes down to safety. A rally cars safety is a whole different world than a circuit cars, where composite panals are more commonly found.

MWP":puwi5n4l said:
I think i would prefer for a brittle FRP roof to break up, than for a steel one to slice me up.

The roof rarely ever gets the opportunity to seperate from the car and begin slicing and if the doors do come off their hinges the chances of them entering the 2'x2' ingress/egress hole for the drivers compartment is slim. That's the benefit of steel, a carbon door would explode sending sharp carbon shards everywhere. The steel on the other hand will just deform & in the roofs case as far as the cage will allow. I included some of the more recent "bad" crashes in the WRC, notice how the roofs never separate from the unibody & only deform to the shape of the cage.

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nw94rs

New member
I filled my antenna hole on my wing today. I fiberglassed the back side and skimmed the top with mud, then sprayed it with some primer. I'll drive it around like this until the car gets painted after winter.
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We also installed some aerocatch hood pins.
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I also found a picture of El Matador Carlos Sainz during a road side service in his 165, you can see what they were doing for door panals back then. Pretty simple, but the door bars on cages were pretty basic back then.
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nw94rs

New member
I got my front end together. I forgot what a pain in the ass it was making the headlights not pop up. I didn't feel like masking my bumper so I just shot them black until I paint the car in the spring. I think I'll convert to the early model grill & headlight buckets come spring time, Looks a bit cleaner.

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I need to build bezels next week, maybe out of carbon?
 

88st165

New member
I look at this thread to give myself motivation to get both mine back on the road. Funny as I have a red and a white one as well. Keep kicking ass. Can't wait to see them done.
 

nw94rs

New member
Thank you guys, I'm excited for this car to come together. I work on it for an hour or two every day after work, & all day on Saturdays. The remaining list until the car is road worthy is getting smaller by the day.

Does anybody know what else is required to use the 205 tranny on a 165 besides the transmission and rear differential. I believe I read somewhere that this conversion will push the rear suspension 20mm on each side. Is that true?
 

phattyduck

New member
nw94rs":2cmd9zu9 said:
Thank you guys, I'm excited for this car to come together. I work on it for an hour or two every day after work, & all day on Saturdays. The remaining list until the car is road worthy is getting smaller by the day.

Does anybody know what else is required to use the 205 tranny on a 165 besides the transmission and rear differential. I believe I read somewhere that this conversion will push the rear suspension 20mm on each side. Is that true?
Transmission: Swap the electric speedo out for the mechanical speedo from the 165 trans.
Rear diff: Nothing, unless you are swapping the rear suspension arms and axles (that's where the extra track is from). If you do swap the complete rear suspension/subframe/diff/arms/axles, you get about 30mm extra PER SIDE on the car. You'll have to figure out how to deal with the added 3*+ of camber.

-Charlie
 

nw94rs

New member
Great thanks for the info.

The rear diff is still required to match the correct gearing of the front transmission correct?
 

MWP

New member
nw94rs":k2tggahw said:
MWP":k2tggahw said:
There's not a single cost cut in today's world rally car.

LOL, of course there is.
You think the teams have an unlimited budget?
Restrictions have been put in place by the FIA to reduce running costs for teams so lower-funded teams have a chance to compete with the big guys.
Things like where carbon can be used around the car, minimum weights, drive train restrictions, are all put in place to reduce cost.

If the FIA didnt set those regulations, we would have full CF rally cars... and they wouldnt be any less safe.
 

nw94rs

New member
What lower funded teams? It's no longer the 90s, if you want to run against the big boys you are forced to use the same equipment as the big boys. Unless you plan on funding the homologation of your own rally car. Composite rally cars are a thing of the past, they were the standard during Gr.B and that proved to be as bad of an idea as their alluminum bolt together roll cages.
 

MWP

New member
nw94rs":2glrxma1 said:
What lower funded teams? It's no longer the 90s, if you want to run against the big boys you are forced to use the same equipment as the big boys.

Yes, which is why FIA are putting (and have been for ~10yrs now) in place cost cutting measures so lower-funded teams can compete.
Why do you think there are limits on tyre use, engine & gearbox life span, manual center diffs, number of team personnel, testing limitations, etc, etc.
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/news ... ed-by-fia/
 
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