abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Mon Jan 27, 2020 10:10 am

Perhaps the fuel injection system exploded view below will help you with your questions.

I believe the plate you are referring to is the engine ID plate (serial no., etc.), but not certain.
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ST185 Fuel Injection System.png
ST185 Fuel Injection System Exploded Parts View
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby alltracman78 » Mon Jan 27, 2020 11:23 am

That's a homemade EGR block off plate.

It's covering the factory gasket, which has those 2 (IIRC there are normally 3?) tabs sticking up.

Not sure what Schrader valve you're talking about? I don't see one. And don't remember one on the fuel rail. You're not talking about the union bolt for the fuel supply line, are you?
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Mon Jan 27, 2020 11:58 am

Well sure enough, I never thought of looking at the EGR system when viewing that plate. But alltracman78 is spot on. You can see how the EGR attached originally to that area (bottom view, with the gasket).
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ST185 EGR System Exploded Parts View.png
ST185 EGR System Exploded Parts View
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Mon Jan 27, 2020 11:09 pm

Hey thanks! Appreciate the diagram. It's (The EGR) is probably garbage emissions stuff anyway, so i don't won't miss it.

Just trying to get it closer to stock to keep the OE ecu happy.

So the side feed injectors have that top plate holding them all down it seems 23261 in the diagram. I guess i don't understand why the top side of the injector has a metal part open? Diagram doesn't really show it either... I'm too new school for the logic i guess. As long as they don't leak that's cool.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Tue Jan 28, 2020 12:09 am

abeans wrote:So the side feed injectors have that top plate holding them all down it seems 23261 in the diagram. I guess i don't understand why the top side of the injector has a metal part open? Diagram doesn't really show it either... I'm too new school for the logic i guess. As long as they don't leak that's cool.

For me, you need to be a bit clearer with your questions. What do you mean by "I guess i don't understand why the top side of the injector has a metal part open?"? The top end of the injector has a vibration insulator above it, which the cover plate uses to hold the injector in place. There is no metal part open. As long as the injector is held down into the fuel rail, and the 2 o-rings (one above the fuel entry point, one below the fuel entry point) are in good shape, it can't leak.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Tue Jan 28, 2020 1:02 am

93celicaconv wrote:
abeans wrote:So the side feed injectors have that top plate holding them all down it seems 23261 in the diagram. I guess i don't understand why the top side of the injector has a metal part open? Diagram doesn't really show it either... I'm too new school for the logic i guess. As long as they don't leak that's cool.

For me, you need to be a bit clearer with your questions. What do you mean by "I guess i don't understand why the top side of the injector has a metal part open?"? The top end of the injector has a vibration insulator above it, which the cover plate uses to hold the injector in place. There is no metal part open. As long as the injector is held down into the fuel rail, and the 2 o-rings (one above the fuel entry point, one below the fuel entry point) are in good shape, it can't leak.

That answers the question. Vibration isolator.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby Magroo » Tue Jan 28, 2020 1:47 am

abeans wrote:Ah! Thanks.. so i need to clock it. That makes sense.

It doesn't seem like i got 2-3" maybe 1" tops. Think thats still it? Holy smokes is that trans heavy.



Pretty sure I saw it listed at 185lbs with fluids.

On a side note. It's possible to remove the trans with the engine in the car? Ive always read from other peoples experience that its impossblr and engine and trans have to come out together.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby underscore » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:42 am

It's physically possible, I know someone that did it. By all accounts it's very unpleasant and not likely to be any faster than just pulling the engine.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby FC Zach » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:45 am

Agreed!
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby alltrac801 » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:08 pm

Damn that looks like a lot of work!

That exhaust is hilarious :lol:

On your last picture that looks like an EGR block off plate. (shit someone else beat me to it)
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:52 am

For those who delete EGR on these vehicles --- just make sure your ignition timing is capable of adjusting in a range closer to 0 deg as your knock sensor picks up detonation when you have no EGR on this high compression engine. The OEM ECU was mapped to compensate timing with the knock sensor knowing EGR was present to partially subside detonation (engine knock). We all know (or should know) what can happen if detonation isn't well controlled on these engines.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:03 am

Not too worried. EGR is closed during wot. Parts car made it 240k with a egr delete, and we got some decent fuel in Michigan. ...and if i don’t end up wanting to jump off a bridge at the end of this project, might treat the car to some Link ECU.


Some more brain dump;

Finished up the floor pan rustproofing. (Thank god) more odds and ends arrived... I THINK i got almost all the gaskets i need to put the engine back together, timing kit arrived.

Need a plan to figure out what i want to do with the giant hole that was expanded from one of the rubber booted firewall holes.. and figure out heatercore lines. A/C is staying deleted because it’s Michigan.

I think i’ll end up keeping the battery in the trunk for some engine bay real estate. The car came with cables and a box, but was pulled though a sharp cut hole (dangerous AF on top of the usual garbage mechanic stuff) so might figure out a cleaner positive cable routing before putting the interior back in.

I appreciate the feedback from everyone keeping me motivated some.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Mon Feb 03, 2020 2:52 pm

Starting working on the water pump and found out rockauto lists the wrong kit for a turbo 1990 Celica. They gave me the non turbo setup. SKF TBK199WP = no fit. :cry:



Also f*** that guy who decided a Phillips head on the water pump was a good idea. (Yes, my coolant cavity's are horrendous)

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Got some of the interior back in. HVAC is back in.

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Bonus pic, picked up a SPAL fan, to compliment the mishimoto. Friend brought over his works CFM reader to see what everyones fan would do... Oem.. aftermarket (SPAL dominated)

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Making some HPDE patches with rivets to fill the terrible firewall cuts... Not the most pretty, but this won't ever be a show car anyway.

Still don't know what to do with the sunroof, going to need a full assembly from a parts car i think. My buddy found a coupe '91 in the junkyard with no sunroof. :(
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Mon Feb 03, 2020 3:38 pm

abeans wrote:Not too worried. EGR is closed during wot. Parts car made it 240k with a egr delete, and we got some decent fuel in Michigan. ...and if i don’t end up wanting to jump off a bridge at the end of this project, might treat the car to some Link ECU.

Just saw this response. I find it an interesting conclusion that an EGR system can be plugged/deleted without consequence. This response contradicts the conclusion.

Yes, by design, an EGR valve is closed when the engine is cold, is idling, or is under wide open throttle. The ECU mapping is designed to retard timing under wide open throttle to compensate for the otherwise normal benefit of EGR into the intake to reduce detonation. So removing EGR has no consequence on an engine when under wide open throttle. That is understood.

Detonation also can happen in an engine at less than wide open throttle. In an engine designed for EGR, the ECU doesn't retard timing as much as an engine without EGR. Knock sensors will help retarding ignition timing further, true. But understand the ECU ignition timing map is based on EGR control and knock sensor feedback. Now, take away EGR that is normally present in this case, and the knock sensor detects knock, the ECU will retard timing only to the extent it is mapped to do (which incorporates the benefits of EGR being partly open). Delete or block EGR, the timing will not retard sufficiently to eliminate knock - so it will be present. Will it be sufficient to damage the engine? I'm not sure, are you? And is that a risk you want to take?

Remap the ECU ignition timing to handle ignition timing as if not EGR was designed to be present, and you would be OK. But in this case, while you are protecting your engine, you really don't get any more torque/power than with an EGR system and an ECU mapped to work with an EGR. Retarding timing more due to the lack of EGR has negative performance results.

Or, block/delete EGR without remapping the ECU ignition timing and live with the added risk. Up to the user. But need to know you are adding risk.

My last response on this topic.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby Magroo » Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:05 am

"Bonus pic, picked up a SPAL fan, to compliment the mishimoto. Friend brought over his works CFM reader to see what everyones fan would do... Oem.. aftermarket (SPAL dominated)"

After buying some of those shitty low profile fans on ebay and realizing they suck I bought a spal fan and made a radiator shroud out of an aluminum cookie sheet.

It seriously helped my temps especially in the summertime.

And yes you read that correctly. I used a $10 aluminum cookie sheet from walmart that was an almost perfect fit. Radiator core was 12.75", the cookie sheet was 13" had to massage it down with a hammer for that 1/4".

It was one like this but sold in store. Was listed at 13x19
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Nordic-Ware- ... t/38576342
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