abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Thu Feb 27, 2020 12:28 am

Anyone know if i can run a ST205 tube?
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abeans
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:12 am

Why didn't anyone say i was missing the 90405-10034 to make the dipstick work? Sheesh. (Update it doesn't)

That's on the way. Thankfully bad obsession motorsports video made it clear to see.

Sunroof is in. It seems sunk on the back slightly, i'm hoping its not all the way closed....:shrug: ?????

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Whipped me up a -10 AN turbo drain. Used part of the ebay black mamba kit (90% garbage, don't bother buying)

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More ebay garbage. Flange isn't even flat. Sending back... Bought a burk.

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Started the battery relocation.

Thin Toyota metal pretty shitty to weld to, but strong enough to hold the Odyssey.

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Cable from the starter...Utilized the airbag sensor hole/bracketry.

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Gotta finish up routing IN the car, which i did 4 times and still not happy with it.

...AND it wouldn't be an update with some more crap i gotta deal with from the PO.

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Last edited by abeans on Fri Mar 20, 2020 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
abeans
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:24 am

Sheeesh...so what is going to hold your MR2 dip stick guide into the union? There is a tab on the MR2 dip stick guide that attaches to something, on an MR2. This one isn't pounded into the block bore for support. Do you have the union you need to use the MR2 dip stick guide?

Also, your sunroof deck cover uses "U-Shaped" spacers when mounting onto the sliders, to ensure alignment to the top of the vehicle roof deck. You likely got many of them from the salvage donor you got yours from. You need as many (or few) spacers as necessary to give the sunroof desk and even fit with the vehicle roof deck w/o it contacting the top surface of the sunroof deck when it lowers and slits under the vehicle roof deck. Those "U-Shaped" spacers come in a variety of thicknesses also.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:47 am

93celicaconv wrote:Sheeesh...so what is going to hold your MR2 dip stick guide into the union? There is a tab on the MR2 dip stick guide that attaches to something, on an MR2. This one isn't pounded into the block bore for support. Do you have the union you need to use the MR2 dip stick guide?


So are you suggesting I have the wrong part ordered? :)

93celicaconv wrote:Also, your sunroof deck cover uses "U-Shaped" spacers when mounting onto the sliders, to ensure alignment to the top of the vehicle roof deck. You likely got many of them from the salvage donor you got yours from. You need as many (or few) spacers as necessary to give the sunroof desk and even fit with the vehicle roof deck w/o it contacting the top surface of the sunroof deck when it lowers and slits under the vehicle roof deck. Those "U-Shaped" spacers come in a variety of thicknesses also.


That is great info,, thank you!
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:08 pm

I'm not saying you have the wrong part ordered - it's that you have to secure the dip stick guide if using the MR2 version. If you don't, every time you pull the dip stick out, the guide will come along with it, as the guide is not secured to the engine (it only has an o-ring holding it into the union). You need to figure out a way to use the tab with the hole near the top of the MR2 guide to secure it in a fashion so that the guide doesn't pull out of the union.
Attachments
lCNenQ5l.jpg
MR2 vs ST185 Dip Sticks & Guides
90405-10034.jpg
90405-10034 Union, Dip Stick Guide
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Wed Mar 04, 2020 5:43 pm

Ah I see. Well, worse case I can whip up a bracket or weld something too it or 3d print.

But that's good to know what I'm getting into.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Sun Mar 08, 2020 1:17 am

Ok, I need help.

There is a lot of stuff that has been deleted from both vehicles so having a hell of a time sorting even with the manual. This seems to be a simplified version probably due to the aftermarket ecu.

Things to note (I didn't do it so don't flame pls.)

EGR is deleted.
Secondary intake butterfly valves are deleted out of the intake. ( VIS? )
Air pipe on the back of the intake manifold is gone.
Charcoal canister from engine bay gone.
Vsv evap sensor thing on the coolant outlet distribution block broke ( both cars oof )

Video as it's easier than drawings and photos:

https://youtu.be/DVwJs8JHuuM


With all this stuff removed, I'm guessing the ecu won't be too pleased with some of it. Let me know what's a must have and where some of this needs to go.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:50 am

So at the end of your restoration, what is it that you want your Celica to be? One that is factory original? Something else?

Unless you have a California emissions version, while the factory ECU "controls" EGR, it does not "monitor" EGR (there is no DTC tripped from a detection something is wrong with it). California emissions setups incorporate an EGR gas temp sensor, and the California emissions ECU will trip if the actual EGR gas temperatures aren't close to the mapping of normal EGR gas temperatures when the EGR is controlling it.

Same goes for the EVAP system, except in this case, the ECU has no part of it's control (just the VSV that you said on yours is broken). It would be interesting to know what you are doing with the EVAP hoses coming from the fuel tank though. If you no longer have an EVAP system, you really should have that port capped.

Then again, you have an aftermarket ECU instead of a factory OEM ECU, so I don't know what your aftermarket ECU is all needing and what it does for DTC codes. I've never used aftermarket ECU's on these.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Sun Mar 08, 2020 12:40 pm

Short term goal is just starting, and idling. Don't care for a true stock restoration, only say that because the technology has improved so much. Obd1 vain air flow meters are terrible.

Long term I am looking for reliability, driveability. No full race car, just a good cruiser.

Aftermarket ecu is very likely, but just want the car to drive under its own power before then.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby Magroo » Sun Mar 08, 2020 3:01 pm

Ecu can be tricked with a 10ohm 1/4 watt resistor for an egr code. Just stick the resistor into the female side and tape it off.

I'm not sure capping off the evap would be a good idea cause you need some kind of vent so the gas tank doesn't build pressure.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Sun Mar 08, 2020 3:21 pm

Magroo wrote:Ecu can be tricked with a 10ohm 1/4 watt resistor for an egr code. Just stick the resistor into the female side and tape it off.

I'm not sure capping off the evap would be a good idea cause you need some kind of vent so the gas tank doesn't build pressure.


Magroo, not true (problem with building gas pressure). The fuel system on this car should never be under vacuum, but pressure is fine. That's why your fuel cap has a vacuum breaker in it - allows outside air in if the fuel tank pressure goes a bit negative to a vacuum, but seals off when under pressure. Think you your car parked on black asphalt at night, then left to sit in the hot Arizona sun all day - no greater situation to cause liquid fuel to expand due to rising temperature and result in a pressure build. The great thing about gasoline, the pressure in the fuel tank will limit itself due to the vapor pressure of gasoline. It will almost never exceed gasoline vapor pressure - as it will condense from a vapor to a liquid. Any ambient air in the fuel tank will not do this, but if the fuel tank is filled normally, most vapor in the tank as the liquid fuel drops in normal engine use will fuel vapor - so it is self-pressure regulating and is fuel tank temperature dependent. Normally, fuel tank pressure will get in the 7-15 psi range, which a fuel tank and components can easily handle.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby Magroo » Sun Mar 08, 2020 8:28 pm

That seems incredibly dangerous saying 7-15 psi is an acceptable pressure for a 25 year old fuel tank that wasn't designed as a pressure vessel.

I'm at work so I'm not able to look at my service manuals to verify. I can see 1-2psi at most but your saying up to 1 atmosphere of addition pressure is ok?

The whole purpose of the evap system is to vent and capture the vapors to be burned on next startup.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby 93celicaconv » Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:24 pm

I see I made an error in my response. The pressure values should have been expressed at 7-15 psia (lbs per sq. in. absolute). At 100 deg F fuel temp, no regional gasoline blend is permitted to have a vapor pressure much above 10 psia, The vapor pressure drops as fuel temps cool, and increase as fuel temps increase. As such, a winter fuel tends to be more volatile (higher vapor pressure at 100 deg F) as ambient temperatures won't approach that high of temperature. Opposite for summer blends. Fuels are also blended based on elevation (Los Angeles, for example, as atmospheric pressure close to 14.6 psia, while Denver is at 12.2 psia). Fuel won't boil to create pressure until the vapor pressure equals or is greater than local atmospheric pressure. So for the most part, fuel tanks should not pressurize at all, but at most, could get 0.5 to 1.5 psi pressure build above ambient (absolute) pressure in very hot conditions, more so at higher altitudes. A properly working EVAP system would prevent the tank pressure from ever getting about say 0.25 psi gauge though.

You guys make the call on the degree of concern the pressure will cause and take appropriate steps. I would return the EVAP system to normal operational conditions, because I always prefer OEM setups. If a car pre-date EVAP systems, they had fuel tank caps that allowed pressure relief (EVAP system vehicles fuel tank caps do not allow pressure relief, but they do allow vacuum relief).
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby Magroo » Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:54 am

Thank you for clarifying that, it makes more sense to me that way.

The only info I could find concerning tank pressure was from a gm service manual for testing the evap system in both positive and negative pressures and they were measured at +/- 7kpa which is +/-1psi.

I will agree the evap system is a personal choice along with complying with local laws. For me my car is registered as an antique and I'm not required to have a state inspection. I removed mine because it cleaned up my engine bay and made it easier for running an fmic.

Again back to the original disagreement. I personally wouldn't cap it off due to tank pressure build up. Either vent it or leave the evap system intact.
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Re: abeans st185 - Kill 1 Save Another

Postby abeans » Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:52 pm

Thanks guys. Nice good discussion back and forth makes a good understanding. - Michigan has no inspection.

I got MOST of the vacuum lines sorted... I think. Need to get the intake to the valve cover This cars vacuum line system is wacky for sure. Took some of the manual reading, i think all i got left is the intake to valve cover and throttle-body and PCV (No PCV valve on this motor?) and brake master (Is the check valve for the master built in?)

My leak was confirmed in the spot i noticed earlier in the thread. Buttened up the fuel system and once it made pressure....

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Im surprised this car ran at all, or didn't burn down. It looks like the oem hardline at one point adapted to a plastic hose? Welp, PO decided sliding fuel injection hose on top of the plastic with two worm gear clamps would work. It doesn't.

I can't get the fittings apart from the hardline to the adapter piece. So i think im going to cut it and flare it to a AN adapter and eventually to a barb.


Getting close to starting. I think if it wasn't for that fuel line it might have cranked over last night.
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